Everywhere you turn. Every draft blog, every chat, every mock draft there's one common theme: The Sixers are going to do something unexpected with the number two pick. I guess you can't blame these guys, I mean, the Sixers are an easy target, but enough is enough.
National writers seem to be scrambling for story lines. The Sixers are reportedly planning to work out the #3 and #4 prospect, which is such a mundane thing and they'd really be irresponsible if they didn't work those guys out, but for some reason that means they aren't taking Evan Turner. Then you have Doug Collins publicly describing the role he sees Iguodala playing (defensive stopper, and more of a slasher than a three-point shooter) and that gets interpreted as Collins being in love with Iguodala to the point where he doesn't want Evan Turner.
You've got the guys who can already tell you Iguodala and Turner won't work together, so the Sixers have to trade Iguodala. You've got guys saying Collins' son really likes Favors, so that means the Sixers won't draft Turner.
Then you've got two different people using the exact same "logic" to draw two different conclusions. "The Sixers have to make the playoffs this season," ergo, they're going to draft Evan Turner, the most NBA ready guy in this draft. Of course, another guy said they weren't going to draft Turner because they have to make the playoffs this season, that same guy also said Turner was the most NBA ready player in the draft, so you explain that one to me.
Anyway, the point is, we're three weeks away from the draft, John Wall is a virtual lock to go number one and either none of these writers have legitimate sources in the Sixers front office, or the Sixers are being tight lipped, as they usually are. So the number two pick is the big draft story at this point.
The national media enjoys writing about the Sixers as if they're a bunch of morons who are bound to screw up this golden opportunity. What they don't get is that the Sixers have drafted pretty well in recent years. They haven't really whiffed with a valuable pick in how long, a decade? They've gotten good value in the mid-lottery several years running. The draft is a strength.
Is Evan Turner the pick? If I had to bet right now, I'd say yes. But you know what, if he isn't, it's going to be because Derrick Favors or DeMarcus Cousins (please not Cousins) absolutely blew them away in workouts. Tony DiLeo and Doug Collins will have seen something in him that made them believe he's going to be a better pro than Turner, maybe sooner, maybe later. It's not going to be for any of these ridiculous reasons these writers are basing their arguments on.
My advice to you guys, if you're like me and can't help yourself from reading all the draft coverage, is to take everything you read with a grain of salt.. If you're pro-Turner, I'd say rest easy. He's probably the guy. If you're pro-Favors, have faith that DiLeo and Collins will see what you do (and I do) in the kid and they'll make the right pick. I doubt we're really going to know who the pick is until David Stern calls the name, so don't let the talking heads get you down.
Brace yourself; because after the draft, free agency will get underway. Expect to see all these same writers suggest that the Sixers trade Iguodala to a team with cap space that strikes out in free agency...
I can see the headlines on daily news now; LOGJAM AT SF POSITION: (UNPROVEN) STAR ROOKIE TURNER MAY FORCE IGUODALA OUT!
by Bill Conlin.
* cliff notes by Stephen A Smith.
Case in point is the Frank Hughes column, SI.com. It's an exercise in mindreading pure and simple. Making shit up. If the Sixers get Wall, they can team him with Iguodala, as if Jrue Holiday isn't on the team. If they get Turner, they have to trade Iguodala, as if he's never played small forward before (and won't this year). As if they don't want one of the 10 best defensive players in the league. You're right Brian, the press has just decided that the #2 pick is a story and they're making up a narrative because, uh, that's what they do.
I think that if the Sixers draft Wall, they still put AI at the 3 and start Holiday & Wall. Why not?
But whenever there's a guy who's the consensus pick, he gets taken. If there was ever a year when that may not have happened, it was '07 when Durant was consensus pick #2. Portland needed Durant's skills more than Oden's, but they took Oden anyway. Nobody wants to take the chance. I think Washington should take Turner, but they won't. (And if they do, I really think we should take Favors.)
If Wall is there at #2, I'd take him. I'd actually love to see Jrue and Wall in the backcourt together.
I actually sent Frank Hughes an email after reading that article telling him, with all due respect, that he was a complete and total moron. Haven't heard back.
thanks Martin. Good times :-)
I am like most , I feel it is 75% Turner and 25% either Favors or a trade down that blows them away. My biggest question in the next 2 weeks is if Johnson gets brought in for a workout, preferably against Turner, because there is no way I trade down unless I really, really like Johnson.
If we were at #4 Johnson vs. Cousins would be the big question. Right now, though, I don't think there's any way we can possibly walk away from this draft without Wall, Turner or Favors. Those guys are clearly the top level to me, and it would be foolish to trade out of that opportunity.
I think it would work very well. Would Wall play SG? Does it matter? I don't see Jrue as a 2.
Should've been a reply to Brian above.
I think the problem (or negative) for Johnson, who I really like as a player, is the same for Favors: both guys might be a little passive, a little too content to be a complimentary part. This team desperately needs "The Man". If ET can be that guy, this team is better than it was two years ago already. Look at the Eastern Conference - Hawks are almost definitely going to lose Joe Johnson, Orlando looks like they'll be good for a while, but have a point guard who is too small, a SG who is too soft, and a C who can't score. Celtics will be a year older and possibly without Ray Allen (FA). And even if LeBron goes back to the Cavs, look at their roster. They aren't THAT good. Now obvious there will be some player movement throughout the league this summer, but I agree with Collins assertion that the Eastern Conference is fluid right now and this team could pretty easily be back in playoff contention.
Please don't kill me for this. I like Evan Turner but I love Favors upside. Not to mention, Turner's back scares me. Also, let me first mention that I might be the only person in town to believe that we can not let Sammy walk, if we draft Turner. I think we should re-sign him for 3 years at about 2/3 his current salary(but that's a whole other issue to kill me over).
If we draft Favors, is there a way, or moreso a possibility of us working out a sign and trade with ATL to acquire Joe Johnson using Sammy and Lou as the centerpieces. The writings on the wall that JJ is gone. If they had a defensive center, Horford could excel at his natural position at the 4. Crawford could start and Lou take his spot as instant offense off the bench.
Of cource, I think it works out good for both teams, but it's my idea. Thoughts?
I would explore my options when it comes to Sammy. If we can acquire a stud player for his expiring contracts I would do it. There may be some good defensive Cs in the draft (Whiteside, Patterson, Aldrich) or in FA like Camby
Portland extended Camby for three years.
Brian: what do you think that means for Oden then?
I think it means Portland isn't expecting him to be on the floor for a full season any time soon. Also means he may be an unrestricted free agent after this coming season.
Keeping Dalembert is a must.....he can play one on one with ANY center in the lead...and block shots and rebound as good as anyone at the C. Plus, he can actually shoot and dribble....
...and we're taking Turner.....Collins already said with his own lips he wants Igoudala at the 3. We really have no 2 who is remotely a complete player...we're taking Turner....no question.
yeah its a must. must if you are an a$$ clown
I like Favors as well. As for the sign and trade, it makes sense on some levels. ATL needs a center badly, Lou is from Georgia and could do some of the things Crawford did for them off the bench. The main problem I have with it is that I think Johnson's going to get a lot more money than he's worth, and I'd rather not get locked into a five or six year deal for him.
Holiday
Johnson
Iguodala
Brand
Favors
That would be a nice starting lineup, though.
fill a hole at Center and create a bigger hole at SG?
cmon do really think anyone believes that Jamal Crawford can start?
Atlanta can't lose him. if they do,maybe they go after Rudy Gay? ... Nah I dont see it happening.
They're going to have two holes when Johnson leaves. Usually, teams don't get anything of use in sign-and-trade deals. If he's walking anyway, they could do much worse than this deal.
Exactly.
I don't think I'd be eager to re-sign a playoff no-show.
Brian you think Brand would still be a decent starter in the NBA? I am doubtful, unfortunately, so that frontcourt would leave me wondering.. don't know much about Favors, never saw him play
BTW long time no talk, but great job as always, keep it going
I finally found this highlight reel from GT. All the others I saw were high school.
This makes me want Favors even if we can't trade back a spot. He seems to have some willingness to put the ball on the floor. He sseems to be working on his footwork. He shoots that little 12 footer. He's huge. And he's a baby(youngest player in the draft). His upside is through the roof. Being introduced to the game under the instruction of a teacher like Collins give this kid the op to be a dominant big by age 20.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RHld4VItav0&NR=1
Looking at that line-up again, it kinda reminds me of Boston. Our big three being JJ, Iggy, and, ummmm, Brand with youth at point and center.
I really want this to happen.
Damn it! Why can't Turner shoot like Wes Johnson? Our decision would be so easy.
if that was the case, we would be unable to draft him anyway, since he'd go #1.
Thus, making our decision for us. Wall would be the easy choice.
At this point, I'd be surprised if the Sixers take anyone but Turner. There's always a lot of misinformation and misleading stuff being floated out there at this time of year, some of it by NBA personnel.
BTW, great album cover -- and great album!
Brian, if you are D.Collins and your g.m. tells you he can get you Beasley for a package of Meeks, J.Smith and either Thad or Marreese would you say yes or no?
yes.
No. Not a Beasley fan at all. If you tell me you can get me Beasley for Lou, I'd do it and then I wouldn't pick up Beasley's option.
It is probably a clearing cap space move for Miami but with Collins here I thought it might be intriguing. Per 36 minute numbers for their career;
E.Brand- 18.7 PTS., 9.4 REB.
m.bEASLEY-18.9 PTS., 7.6 REB.
He would be an interesting p.f. to run the floor with Turner, Iggy and Jrue if Collins got him to buy in.
Beasley. Ugh. I rather have this broken down Brand. Even Lou Amundson.
Would I give up value for him, no. But if he cost me barely nothing and Collins got to talk to him before a deal was done, I would think about it. He is the ideal kind of athlete to play the 4 with a running team and, like I said, before Collins got here I would of said no.
Normally, it's funny to just dump someone who was in their regular rotation: http://www.82games.com/0910/0910MIA2.HTM
But considering Beasley's off the court problems and the Heat's interest in FA signings it makes sense. By the same logic, they are probably only interested in trading him to a team that can absorb salary right away.
I wonder about the "running team" idea. Have any of the stat heads figured out how to do an analysis of what makes the best running team. It seems to me the optimal team must 1) get a lot of stops on defense, 2) do well at defensive rebounding, 3) have at least two players who are not the main rebounders who are threats to beat their man down the court, and 4) manage good outlet passes. I guess Beasley could contribute to item "3)" but that seems like a marginal contribution.
The "runnning team" idea? It's a fantasy. How many running teams are there? Phoenix and GS....maybe Okla City. I'm not even sure Phoenix is a running team, they're just an early offense team. Besides, they don't rebound well enough.
You have to get the rebound and make the pass to run, and the rebounds just aren't there. There aren't enough shots taken to create the opportunities, certainly not in bunches. The Lakers took 76 shots in Game 1, the Celtics took 67. When teams were running, there were 90, 100, 110 shots per game - look at the old box scores. Fewer shots, fewer misses (rebounds), fewer chances to run.
Plus, the coaches are control freaks.
I say 50% chance they take Turner, 25% chance they take someone else and 25% chance they trade the pick. That is based on an estimated 99% chance they are hoping for a good trade offer, but only 25.01% chance they receive an attractive one.
If we could end up with Wes Johnson and Cousins, by giving up the #2 pick and any player other than AI9 or Jrue would you.
No. I don't want any part of Cousins, none at all.
I'm not sure how that would be possible. What trade would give us the #4 and #5 picks with us sending out the #2 and say Thad?
I would rather keep Turner and see if I can pry the #8 pick out of the Clippers hands (with a Thad-centric package) to take Aldrich or Udoh. That seems more plausible than getting #4 and #5...
I do not think Cousins is going to go at 5, I was thinking more along the lines of 6 to 8. Between the red flags he raised in college and the combine I think he is going to drop. I don't like Cousins that much, that being said if Doug or Tony think they can get his head on right you never know.
What is a trade you think that would blow them away, and let us fill more than one need? Knowing that they are saying that they will take time to rebuild this team.
Would you trade Brand, Young, and the number 2 pick To Golden State for Monta Ellis, Anthony Rudolph and the number 6 pick?
No. Not an Ellis fan. The #6 pick would be interesting if Cousins was on the board.
But this sounds like too many punks on one roster:
Ellis, Cousins, A. Randolph, Speights and Lou
The only non-punks would be Jrue and Iguodala (and Iguodala whines a lot.)