Everyone, including Doug Collins, realizes the starting lineup(s) he's trotted out there simply don't work. I'm not quite sure why he's sticking to his guns after a 1-4 start, but judging from the minute distribution, it's clear he has no faith in two of his starters. Here's the question, what would your starting five be if you were calling the shots?
Let me ask another question before I get to my starting five: Is there any chance putting Nocioni into the starting lineup (and keeping him there) is a way to keep him happy without religiously sticking to the 20 minutes/game mandate?
OK, I've got three possible lineups, each with pros and cons, here goes:
- PG: Holiday
- SG: Turner
- SF: Iguodala
- PF: Thad
- C: Brand
Obviously, this lineup lacks bulk up front, but the tradeoff from Hawes to Thad on the glass isn't really that much of a loss. Overall, I think this is probably a better rebounding team than the starting lineup because you get Turner on the floor, who may be the team's best pure rebounder (his 22.8% defensive rebounding rate would be a good number for a center. The guy is a shooting guard.). Holiday and Turner seem to be doing a good job on the floor together. They're sort of taking turns running the point, and each seems to be getting more comfortable off the ball, not only catching and shooting, but cutting off the ball. You've got three playmakers and two finishers on the floor. Obviously, long-range shooting is lacking from this unit, and the bench is weakened a bit.
- PG: Holiday
- SG: Williams
- SF: Turner
- PF: Iguodala
- C: Brand
Call this the merit-based lineup. Lou has been the team's best player through the first five games. This lineup is very small, but again, probably a better rebounding unit than the two starting lineups Collins has utilized so far this season. Iguodala is the second-best defensive four on this roster right now behind Brand. This lineup would be extremely fast, they could easily switch everything on the perimeter, trap, force turnovers and turn them into quick points. My problem with playing Jrue, Turner and Lou at the same time is that for some reason, Lou winds up playing the point. He dominates the ball, which isn't wise considering he's probably the fourth-best playmaker on the floor. The best scorer, but he's doing a poor job of setting up his teammates and running the offense. They'd need to find a better way to balance things on that end of the floor. Run a set with Turner or Jrue at the point, if nothing's there, then go to Lou for isolation when the shot clock is working against you. On the defensive end, Lou would probably have to be guarding the ball, which negates Jrue's strength in that area, which I don't like.
- PG: Holiday
- SG: Turner
- SF: Iguodala
- PF: Brand
- C: Speights
The only "traditional" starting lineup, this one is extremely dependent on Speights' ability to contribute something other than scoring. If he's rebounding like he did last night, it works. If he's taking charges, or at least moving his feet to get in front of drivers, it works. If he's a zero on the defensive end, I'd rather have the added offense from either of the first two lineups than the added heft of putting Speights in there. The huge bonus of this lineup is you have a big who's capable of finishing when Jrue, Turner and Iguodala pressure the defense and find him on the inside. Brand has been great, but he isn't explosive enough to throw a dunk down in traffic when Jrue threads the needle. Speights can catch it and finish, a skillset unique to him among the bigs on the roster.
In a perfect world, I'd go with the third option, I think. Putting Lou or Thad into the starting lineup does surface a number of problems, including weakening the bench. This isn't a perfect world, though, so I think for the time being, I'd go with option number one. The bottom line is the Sixers have four guys who should be starting, no matter what. The fifth guy can really be the smallest guy on the team to the biggest, that speaks both to the lack of depth on this roster and the positional versatility of the better players.
What do you guys think? Pick one of the lineups above or come up with one of your own in the comments.
Turner and Holiday, plus whichever three players would lose us the most games. Hawes, Brackins, and... Meeks, I guess.
Number three. I would eventually like to rotate in Thad (for Speights) and then a minute or two later Battie comes in (for Brand). I really only like 8 guys on the team, so I guess the Mullet should get spot minutes to make sure they don't wear out. The backcourt really should just be a 4-man unit (JTI and Lou rotating one guy out at a time) with Mullet maybe stealing 10 minutes a game there.
So 96 minutes at the 4/5 between Brand, Battie, Speights and Thad? Or are you saying work Nocioni into the PF rotation too?
A little bit of both. Ah, probably 15 is probably more realistic for The Mullet if we're cutting Hawes completely out: 10 at SF and 5 at PF.
35 for Brand, 25 for Thad, 25 for Speights, then 6 and 5 for Battie/Nocioni. Something like that. Not sure you can count on Speights for that many minutes, but you could obviously play around w/ the ratios.
I'd personally like Battie to play more than 6 minutes. 12-15 would be preferable with him and you can take most of those minutes from Speights to get him around 20.
Plus, I think Nocioni should have Iguodala and Turner with him when he plays the 4.
Hollinger w/ a good point here. Luckily, it's just Sixers' fans who do this here, not management. Though management is inept in so many other ways:
The Sixers' roster is not without talent. It's pieces don't compliment each other very well and they having areas of redundancy and glaring weakness - this makes them a bad TEAM.
The big problem is that they are a bad ORGANIZATION. They have no consistency in orgnization philosophy, they change plan and leadership on a regular basis and are treated as the red-headed step child of Comcast Spectacor.
Changing players in and out won't make a difference if there isn't a larger scale change in the way that this organization does things.
Hire leaders, empower them to makes real changes amd give them the financial resources to compete. Oh, and build a goddamn practice facility
I love the random practice facility chirp at the end. No way do they move away from PCOM unless they can find another location with a Chili's nearby.
They could build a Chili's-to-Go in the new facility. Maybe a Chick-Fil-a while they're at it. You just have to think out the box and push the right buttons.
You know an Argentinian Steakhouse would be the answer to this team's problems.
Four games into his NBA career, and Favors leads all rookies in PER (24.86) and all of the league in rebound rate (26.3), as noted by TrueHoop's Henry Abbott.
Seems like we will be seeing Turner in the starting line-up pretty soon.
I guess we'll larn to what extent 3 fantastic rebounders at PG/SG/SF can make up for weakness up front.
Interesting note an Brand. His DRR% is up from last year, but still lower than his career average.
2009/10: 14
2010/11: 17
Career: 19
Sam 2010/11: 30
Overall, Brand's per 36min numbers this year are almost identical to his career numbers Like I joked the other day, Brand is back to his Clipper days of being the best and most productive big on a lottery team.
Yup. Does he have trade value if he's still playing like this in January?
Nope. Too much salary right before the CBA.
But it would be great if he plays like a productive 8M player. The first 2 years he was not even an asset to the team.
You might be able to find a contending team willing to take on just one extra year of Brand's deal, though.
I keep thinking Orlando, for some reason.
Yeah, maybe a team sends back a lousy 2 yr deal in place of Brand's 3 yrs... but I tend to doubt it.
Gortat + Reddick for Brand? We'll throw in Hawes for free.
I actually wonder if the Sixers will try and do what the Kings did with CWebb. Trade him for 3 samall and longer deals to a team that thinks he can help. That way the team is not taking on any net salary, while the Sixers can more easily dispose of the small pieces of garbage.
Christ, if they take back longer deals I'm moving to Canada.
Canada's not so bad...
I can stomach an extra year for small contracts like QRich or Duhon, who make 3-4M for 4 more years.
Hey, lots of us folk might be moving to canada after november 2012
But anyway, let me just say something
"Keeping Nocioni Happy" or keeping a promise to him should not have one shred of relevance in determining the rotation of players and minutes on this team
That doesn't save years, does it?
I was thinking Iguodala + Brand for Carter, Gortat and Pietrus or Redick. Gets us to serious cap space after next season w/ VC, Pietrus and Nociono coming off the books. Also gets us a top lottery pick the next couple years, I think. Redick and Gortat could be pieces of the puzzle, maybe.
Jrue
VC
Turner
????
Gortat
as your starters. That's a bottom 5 team, no?
btw, I don't think I'd make this deal, just one that sort of made sense on some level.
If you are that bad, cap space only gets you so far. You'd need really good management in place.
This team is a LONG way away. I'd focus on getting a quality big for Iguodala, and let Brand eventually become an expiring. I would not dilute Iguodala's value by chaining Brand on. It's not last summer, where a bunch of quality FA's are hitting the market.
I'd like to start selling Dwight Howard on actually having a couple guys on his team who are capable of making life easier for him on the offensive end when he hits free agency. Put him on the floor with Jrue and Turner with a couple years under their belts and we could be talking about a title contender.
Man, I need some sleep. This day is killing me.
Dwight will be on Chris Paul's team in 3 years.
Probably.
I agree that this team goes nowhere without a young big...and short of getting lucky in the lottery (again), the deal that makes the most sense is seeing if Iguodala brings you one.
Before Brian and jem bury me, I recognize that Iggy is a fine player (and I probably got a bit carried away with that last-possession-in-regulation defense rant)...but I am concerned about whether he is truly willing to step back and be the ultimate "glue guy" as Jrue and Turner eventually take over the team. For now, they are both deferring to Iguodala - as they should - but for the two of them to grow and become the players that they can potentially be, I think that Iggy will either have to take a step back and let them both take a step up...or we should move him to get the young big that this team will need if they are going to be a 50+ win contender in 2-3 seasons.
I don't disagree that they should explore moving Iguodala for a young, inexpensive big who can be a long term fit here. I think you're wrong about the rest, though. Iguodala is taking fewer shots now than he has since Iverson left the team. He's already taking more of a back seat to the young guys.
Yep, he was never a great defensive rebound, just decent. He was a great offensive rebounder, though. That number is better than it's been since he was 23 at 13%.
Through 5 games:
Sixers:... 490 pts
Opponents: 491 pts
Record 1W- 4L
Funny, right? Differential says they should be 2-3 :)
And they probably should.
Sixers stats are interesting (because its only 5 games.)
http://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/PHI/2011.html
WS/48:
Brand...: 0.282
Lou.....: 0.245
Iguodala.:0.079
Jrue....: 0.038
"I'm not quite sure why he's sticking to his guns"
I was thinking about this last night and the only theory i came up with is that I think he wants to have Spencer hawes+Noc out there in the start of each half is to prevent any abuse of mismatches due to size at the start of games. I think he wants to keep anyone from getting into a rythm (ie Hibbert vs Brand at the 5, Hibbert gets comfortable with the size advantage for the majority of game)
Basically the first 6 minutes of the half he just wants to stay as close as he can and then he puts in his fresh subs of ET and Thad and tries to win the final 18 mins of the half. That's my best guess lol.
Anyway my starting lineup. would be
Jrue
Turner
Iggy
Brand
Battie
I don't have any faith in Thad/Speights/starting due to their defensive liabilities.
WTF.
There was no "replying to comment xxx" selected I even checked this time.
Sorry again for replying when i meant to comment.
Just looking for a show of hands. I'm thinking December 12th, against the Hornets, might be a good day for our first field trip of the season. It's a Sunday game, starts at noon. The Eagles play the Cowboys that night at 8:30, so no conflict there. Who would be in for that game?
We'd get to see Willie too! I'd probably be in for that one.
Hah, I'm actually in town for my Grandmother's 90th (the day before.) But I worry about a noon game. I'll probably need a drink or two to handle the Sixers live (and the intense social pressure.) And noon is a bit early to hit the till.
In terms of entertainment value:
Grandma's 90th Birthday party v. Sixers game.
Only the exciting return of WG and T-Rex pushes the Sixers over the top.
My Current vote:
PG: Holiday
SG: Turner
SF: Iguodala
PF: Thad
C: Brand
After AI9 trade
PG: Holiday
SG: Turner
SF: Thad
PF: Brand
C: NEW BIG MAN
^^^ That would be a great rebounding team..
I love Iggy, but it's time to ship him off for a big man to round this team out.. One can hope...
Your name is awesome. Amazing.
lol thx man.. It's my fantasy basketball team name and logo. Figured I'd use it here too..
Word.
(nice name/avatar, BTW...I'm probably seeing Steve and his striped shirt 2/3 times a week...)
If Thorn could get Ibaka or even DeAndre Jordan for Iguodala, I would be open to it. While I like Love, I don't know if he can roll with EB...but I might be open to that as well.
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