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Feelings On Thaddeus Young

I see Thad as our sixth man next year. They need to make a move for a shooting 2 or 3, and I think Thad coming off the bench will lead to a lot of mismatches (if he's used correctly). I want to see Iguodala moved to the two permanently, Wes Johnson drafted to play the three and shoot lights out, and Thad to come off the bench and spell Johnson, or to play with Iggy and Johnson creating a very quick, very athletic, very long 2,3,4 combination. Along with Sam patrolling the paint and Jrue hounding the other teams PG, I could see that crew really doing some damage defensively and getting into the open court and running.

Thank God for hopeful Sixers posts again.

Thank God for hopeful Sixers posts again.

I know, it's been a while, right?

Unless a clear cut better player is acquired, I want Thaddeus starting at the 3 next year over guys like Willie Green, Louis Williams, or Jodie Meeks. I want to see Thad primarily at the 3, with a defined role. Both the previous two years we've bailed on that.

I definately see flashes in some of Thads game.

Partly that was due to the team being in "playoff team" mode. And everything ES says indicates he wants a quick fix. Which does not bode well for player development.

During Thad's rookie year I really thought he was going to develop into a legit star in the league and thought Billy K got a steal at that pick in the draft. During his 2nd year when he didn't improve that much from his rookie year, my thinking was that Thad was still going to be a good player but more of a good 2nd/3rd option than a star. Now after his this disaster of a year I am starting to think that Thad will be nothing more than a 6th/7th man. He really doesn't do anything really well (except for run the floor) and he just seems like a bench player to me.

On this path who knows what we will think of him next year?

At 22 (this June) Thad still has 2-3 years until he hits his peak... but he has a long way to go. How many young players take a step back their 3rd NBA season and go on to be very good players? (I honestly don't know.)

His athleticism and purported good work effort mean he could be a late bloomer/M.I.P. type, or he could evolve into a variation of Hakkim Warrick.

I would give him heavy minutes at SF next year. Playing him at PF does not help his development or long term prospects. But expect some struggles.

The other issue is his 7.5M cap hold next summer that is standing in the way of any usable cap space next summer. But on the flip side, they may end up with a bargain resigning him at a modest number through his prime (Lou like contract.)

Basically see him as an asset but not necessarily as a yet building block. I would consider using him to trade for someone like Rudy.

If anyone's bored at work, I could use a little help for a post I'm writing. I've been hitting the button on Chad Ford's draft lottery machine off and on all day, but I can't get Indiana or Memphis into the #3 slot. If you get a chance, give it a try and if either of those teams come up with the third pick, just post in the comments here who Ford has them picking. Thanks in advance (I think Ford may have stacked the odds :)

That was a scarring experience. I just had the Sixers in 8th... with Cole.

He has Indiana taking Favors at 3 too. The best part of doing this was that he has Utah taking Cousins at 3. I'd say EFJ has a better shot of getting invited to your house for dinner than Jerry Sloan taking Cousins.

Thanks again. The post will be up late tonight.

S reply to Brian on Apr 22 at 17:45

I keep getting number 7, WTF?

No luck after about 15 attempts.

Your description of Thad reminds me of Michael Beasley...

I think thad is pretty good, but the team was actually playing pretty well with kapono starting and thad being hurt, i could see him coming off the bench but playing alot of minutes when elton brand and kapono need a sub (kapono prob wont play many minutes anyway). The team played a few real good games with kapono starting and a legit three point threat to get the ball from the blocks, but young was not even in the lineup. This team could actually have a really good bench next year if we get a decent kid in the draft

He has Memphis taking Favors. (took me about 15 tries)

Gracias. I'm literally in the hundreds right now and still haven't gotten Indy or Mem.

Thad could have suffered the most from Jordan. His role was not even undefined, it was nonexistent. Every day, his role became different and by the end even I didn't really care about what Thad was doing. I thought this guy was going to be a stud 8 months ago!! The big thing for Thad is minutes at the three. I think we are too offensively focused in the breakdown of Thad though. He has to learn how to move his feet better or simply become a smarter defender if he is going to defend threes. He struggles with that this year.

I thought Thad's biggest problem on the defensive end (at the three) was just not knowing where the hell he was supposed to be. I think the crazy rotations effected him more than anyone. He just got lost out there. Play him at the three, play an aggressive system that makes some kind of sense, and see where he's at defensively at the three. He, more than anyone, needs a fresh start.

I haven't completely given up on him, but he's a piece I would part with to move up, or pick up an asset with fewer unknowns who fits the overall system.

Rich reply to Brian on Apr 22 at 16:37

He was confused with the rotation and his answer was to just run around like a chicken with his head cut off. Still, I don't think right now he's very good at keeping his man in front of him as a 3. Not good enough for a team that wants to defend and run. Give him a chance with a good defensive coach, but pay careful attention to that. Teams like the Celtics went at Thad with whoever he was guarding as opposed to Iguodala.

Yep, just like Orlando in the playoffs last year.

IMO, Thad is an Asset with potential. As you said, he needs to become a knockdown three-point shooter with a passable handle to be an effective 3. One of the odd quirks about him is that this year, he shot 40% from three on the road, whereas the season before, he shot 40% from three at home. So, provided no more bad advice, there is a reasonable chance he will evolve into an effective 3-pt shooter.

My optimistic scenario would be the Sixers draft Favors & bring in a coach that helps Speights to become a passable defender and effective defensive rebounder. Jrue & Favors could become the closest thing in the league to the Glove & the Reignman in their heyday while Thad becomes an effective post-up wing who is a proficient three-point shooter(basically Rashard Lewis/Antawn Jamison).

If that happens, you have a lineup with 3 plus defenders and 2 serviceable yet athletic defenders, where all 5 guys can run the floor and all 5 guys have the likelihood of being able to post their matchup in almost every single game. When stuck in the halfcourt, you could run Screen/Roll with Jrue at anytime when not running post isos for the best matchup/hot hand.

That's a really good point, about posting up all five players. Doesn't that type of versatility lend itself to the triangle, or at least triangle philosophies?

I'd say so. The Triangle is also known as the Triple-Post Offense, due to the common starting position on the triangle side of the floor of a player on the low block, a player in the high post and a player on the wing to feed it inside.

On the weakside, there is a player on the low block with a player on the wing. The key is to get the ball down on the either block as one of the initial passes and then move off that player. It produces a fair share of jumpers, but they tend to be of the inside/out variety, as opposed to the side-to-side or handoff-pullup type of jumper in the PO.

Often, the Lakers will post Kobe on the weakside to give him more space or they will post him in that high post position on the Strong side and then clear the low block player through. The Jordan-era Bulls used to work something similar for MJ.

If I recall correctly, they used Shaq in that Strong side post position role most often, using the movement during the setup to get him deep catches inside.

As you said, the Triangle does like to play with that "interchangeable" parts mode that the PO did, one of the key differences from my understanding is the Triangle emphasizes post play and getting the ball inside to exploit mismatches that way.

BTW, this was one of my problems with the PO for this team; it is entirely designed to use strengths and combat weaknesses that this team doesn't have. That whole backcut/backdoor/dribble handoff crap was to create openings in a defense that wanted to prevent you from shooting open jumpers all day. If they don't need to honor the jumper, they don't overplay, ergo no backdoor. IMO, that is why Braces used to encourage them to shoot those long twos you hate so much. Without the threat of that, the offense fails.

JohnEMagee on Apr 22 at 16:19

Sadness, Confusion, Anger, Disdain

If you trust the PER numbers at 82games.com, Thad went from a +2.3 last year to -4.1 this year. My impression is that his defense suffered more than his offense this year, and the PER numbers bear that out (-1.4 on offense, a whopping -5.0 on defense).

Digging a little further, Thad's numbers this year were horrendous at SF, though he only played a quarter of his minutes there. His PER at SF was 12.5, at PF 17.2 (defensive PER was almost the same, 19.4 at SF, 20.8 at PF). As others have noted, the PO rarely created plays where Thad could take advantage of his good touch in the post. By the time they scrapped the PO, Thad was playing mostly PF (and the team was running more, so he got more good shots in transition).

Going forward, I think the key for Thad on defense -- no matter what position he plays -- will be to learn to use his athleticism more effectively and to play a more physical style of defense. He shouldn't let small PF's (e.g., Rashard Lewis) torch him in the post and he shouldn't let average SF's drive around him at will.

And on offense, I still think he needs to play to contact better -- i.e., he doesn't always have to rush or alter his shot to avoid contact. That he needs to shoot a better FT pct. is also a given.

You bring up a good point when you mention Randy Ayers. Widely believed to have messed up Thad's shot, does anyone know anything about his future with the team now that Jordan is gone?

I'd say 99% he's history.

And his official title was, "Randy the defensive guru Ayers." He's only a shot doctor in his spare time.

deepsixersuede on Apr 22 at 18:39

I agree with ryano that a Johnson, Iggy and Thad trio could get out and run all night but for some reason I could see our g.m. passing on Johnson for one of the bigs because a]his overvalueing his players [Thad] and b] needing a defensive big. I love Thad as a 6th man and hope that remains his role, I remember a quote by somebody this year that he has more freedom and less structure coming off the bench and seemed to embrace it.

JohnEMagee reply to deepsixersuede on Apr 22 at 18:41

Thaddeus young was technically drafted by Billy King, so he's not Stefanski's players. Though I think it's TOny Dileo making the picks, and I think he knows what he's doing.

That's a nice running group - could they defend or rebound their way out of a wet paper bag?

deepsixersuede reply to JohnEMagee on Apr 22 at 18:50

Ryano!s point was that trio being your 2/3!s for the year and in those roles they should hold their own on the boards but 10 to 15 minutes a night, out there together could be interesting. Even though E.S. didn!t draft him he tends to consider all his players on the roster in high regard.

JohnEMagee reply to deepsixersuede on Apr 22 at 18:51

Anyone who holds willie green in 'high regard' should be banned from the NBA for life

deepsixersuede reply to JohnEMagee on Apr 22 at 18:55

Your gonna miss him !!!

I am probably a minority but i actually think that Thad Young will still become a very good player even after this terrible season. He's got the talent, the athleticism and the work ethic needed.
The reason he regressed this year is simple. The system employed by EFJ couldn't have been a worse fit for Young. The key aspects of the system are: ability to hit long twos, handling the ball, constant passing, forcing smaller players to guard bigger ones. These are pretty much the only holes in Youngs game and they were magnified with the system.
Don't get me wrong Young really tried to fit in (especially early on), but his skill set simply wasn't compatible to what was asked of him.
As for his rebounding woes, i actually think he is a decent rebounder. The biggest reason why he doesn't get a lot of defensive rebounds is the fact that he is asked to be the first guy running the break. You can't both focus on getting the rebound AND run a fast break.
With the right system Young will quickly bounce back, especially if he plays at SF, which is his natural position IMO.

I see him shooting the three at league average, improving his ball handling, and making plays more than I see him being able to rebound and guard big PFs.

I believe ball handling and shooting were two of the things he worked on last off-season. He'll probably try to improve upon these again.

I think his upside could be starting three, but most likely a 6th man. I'm not sure if age matters as much as years of experience in the NBA.

Thad Young is an enigma to me;
He has a rare skill set, but does that mean it is valuable?
he has the ability to play the 3 or the 4 positions, but yet cannot really play either.
He thrives in the post against bigger 4s offensively using quickness but is unable to use strength against smaller 3s.
he can score at will, but is that enough?
he is a post player that gets to the line like a spot up shooter.
he is an outside shooter that drives like a power forward.
He is quick, athletic with a good wingspan but why does he struggle on defense?
He is young and talented, but why does the rest of the league seem uninterested?
He works hard and has the right attitude, but does that guarantee success?
He is versatile, but why are we always talking about a fit for him?

I've always wanted to like Thad, just don't know which one. IMO the book is closed already. he is a bench guy, not good enough to be a starter.
weird because i always thought he possessed all the tools needed. physically there does not seem to be much missing...

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