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Pressing Questions - October 8

That list is pretty interesting Brian. The best we can hope for is that the high free throw rate indicates that defenders are resorting to fouling him because there is no other way to stop him from getting a good look.

If that is true, then the kid will only get better and more efficient with time. We have to hope that his adjustment time (in terms of speeding up his offensive arsenal) is the biggest issue here. In the back of my head though, all I keep thinking is that Turner may be the Dukiest non-Duke player ever.

He's going to have to start making those good looks, if he's creating them. They'll stop fouling him if he isn't a threat to score. This is a good base, though. Actually, it's probably a better sign than a guy who's hitting a decent percentage of his shots, but can't buy a trip to the line.

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deepsixersuede on Oct 8 at 7:41
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I questioned last night our coaches idea of sitting the 2 veterens at one time, instead of seperately. K.Fagan's article today talks about team leadership, maybe Collins wanted one of the youngins to show , on the court, an ability to be a third voice of the coach, along with Iggy and Elton.

Hmmn, if that was his goal, I don't think it worked out all that well.

How do you feel about Collins having no practice the day after that game?

I don't mind if Collins gives the team a day off, maybe he figured the team was fatigued physically and mentally. Sometimes the best idea after a bad performance is to just get away and forget it for a day, then come back fresh and ready to work hard the next day.

I hope in the next few preseason games that Collins gives Jrue and Turner some significant minutes together on the court, see if they can get into a flow together out there. Games don't count in the standings, great time to do it and help them work things out.

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Rob_STC on Oct 8 at 8:52
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Love this picture which we have seen a lot of (empty seats). The Sixers need to pull it together this pre season or other than the Heat game they will continue to have scores of empty seats. I would wonder why they wouldn't go after a guy like Dampier especially needing a defensive presence at Center. One thing about OKC they didn't have that in their starting lineup but they played Ibaka at least 20 minutes a game to prvide that defensive presence. This is what the Sixers need right now to shore up the defense.

I'm not sure what's going on with Dampier, but you'd have to assume he's going to want more than the veteran's minimum. If he's forced to settle for the minimum, you'd have to assume he wants to go to a good team, with a chance to go to the playoffs.

What they really needed to do was buy a pick early in the second and draft a defensive big project like Whiteside. Too bad they were at Chili's when the second round was playing out.

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Rodney Buford reply to Rob_STC on Oct 8 at 10:52
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re: Dampier - why would he be motivated here? Given his track record and given this team, he would sign a deal and then get hurt or gain weight and be worthless.

De-pressing question day.

Bummed the game won't be aired (or even streamed) Saturday. Sometimes I question why I chose to follow the Sixers over the Phillies.

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T McL reply to tk76 on Oct 8 at 9:41
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tk, because you aren't, like most Philly fans, a front runner. I thought it was hilarious when everyone got mad at J-Roll a couple of years ago when he called Philly fans frontrunners. Everyone made excuses and complained.

All you have to do is look at the Sixers now and the Phillies pre-Citizens Bank Park to know the reality. Our fans don't understand that the best way to bring success to a franchise is to support it with ticket/gear purchases. Instead we have people on Philly.com who think "Stiff"anski is the most clever nickname on earth. (not that I disagree with their assessment of Ed, but what an incredibly stupid nickname)

I think the general feeling of Philly fans toward the Sixers is actually slipping from apathy to hatred. If you're on Twitter, do a search for "Sixers" and check it out. I'd say like 75% of the chatter is "F*&% the Sixers," or "Phillies, Eagles, Flyers, screw the Sixers." Stuff like that. Oh, and d-bags talking about how great it's going to be seeing the Heat on opening night.

Or Philadlephia hasn't been a basketball town for decades contrary to the meme people keep spouting that it is. It's a football/hockey/baseball/ COLLEGE basketball town but it's not really an NBA town.

I don't know. The FU Center was completely insane during Iverson's prime.

Playoff games I went to there were the best playoff atmosphere I've ever witnessed. Better than the the clinching game of the World Series, in fact, and I'm talking about a first round game against Orlando. Attendance was near the top of the league too.

I think it's just a matter of fans being fickle, relatively poor, and having multiple options on where to spend their sports entertainment dollars. Put a crappy product on the floor, and the other options look better.

I don't know. The FU Center was completely insane during Iverson's prime.

Sure, people show up for winning or for superstars, for the show, but what percentage of sixers 'fans' show up for mediocrity (or worse) compared to mediocre eagles/flyers/phillies teams.

A teams popularity in relation to the other teams in the city is defined not when they're winning, everyone loves winners and the super star show, but when they're losing. How are they drawing in the down years?

About the same as the Phillies were drawing 10 years ago. 13th of 16 teams in the NL. Philadelphia isn't a baseball town either, unless the Phils are winning.

Put a crappy product on the field, you aren't going to draw. Unless you're the Eagles, I guess. Pretty sure they sold out even in the Ray Rhodes days.

What was the perecentage. That's usually what I look at. Then again, the phils were in the vet when they stank too and the vet sucked. Be interesting to see what happens when they are over paying ryan howard and the team isn't as good in the CBP

What do you mean by percent? They were at 1.6M fans/year, so under 20K/game.

Percentage of seats filled, but that's pretty crappy - the vet sat way too many people for a baseball game. That's under 40% I think

The Vet fit 64,000.

Then 20K is under 40% :)

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Rich reply to GoSixers on Oct 8 at 11:42
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I think you are right though, I feel the Vet made up for a lot of those empty seats, as it was a dump by its later years. Plus, the Braves won like 15 division titles in a row, so there was no hope to win and they hadn't done it for a long while (Not defending this, but it is better than how the Sixers dropped). One CBP opened though, they had good attendance, and that was in '04 I believe. I actually think this run of Phillies success is going to by them more time if they fall back for a year or two. People will still come.

As for Philly, a lot of bandwagon Sixers fans that jumped on and off the Iverson bandwagon (these same people were very excited for one game last year). Best college hoops town and the high school hoops are very big as well. Not really a pro hoops town.

The phillies have been competitive since CBP opened there haven't been any lean CBP years yet so nothing really to look at just yet.

In a few years when the roys are on the downside, the phils are over paying howard and rollins and utleys injuries catch up to him we'll see how it goes.

Here's the thing about the Iverson era...many of those fans (I think) were not sixers fans but Iverson fans. They loved to watch this scrappy little guy in a world of giants dominate. It's great for attendance but you don't always win and the team holds on to him (4 years) too long

I don't really have another era to compare it to in philly. I know people talk about a playoff clincher not being sold out back in the early 80s (I believe), but I was too young to remember what support was like at the time.

In Barkley's prime, attendance wasn't great.

Were the sixers that good in barkley's prime? I don't think barkley alone was the draw that an Iverson was.

They won 58 his rookie year (that team was still stacked, but older), then 53 in the year I linked to above. Made the playoffs every year but one while he was in Philly.

When I started to follow the Sixers in the late 70's, they led the league in road attendance (because of Dr. J and Darryl Dawkins) but their home attendance was spotty. In the 1980-81 season, they played a home Game 7 against the Bucks in the Eastern Conference semis and drew around 7500 fans (and the capacity was 18,276 in the Spectrum). So Philly was an even worse pro basketball town back then (to be fair, then NBA wasn't as prominent back then either). By the way, the Sixers won that Game 7 by 1 point, so people missed a great game.

When people say Philly is more of a hockey town than a (pro) basketball town, they're probably thinking of the late 70's and early 80's when the Sixers won a championship and made three other finals but still were outdrawn by the Flyers, who sold out every game.

Right, now I remember that game. The Phillies were playing in town the same day. I think it was Game 7 against Milwaukee in '81. Great series by the way. It was the closest Nellie ever got to the Finals, I think.

The attendance was less than 7,000 if I remember correctly.

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Rodney Buford reply to Brian on Oct 8 at 18:52
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I second that Brian! I was at the clinching game against the Magic in '99 - insanity. Great experience.

Its not for lack of trying. I want to jump on the Phillies bandwagon,because they are a great team and fan friendly. But I just lack the emotional investment that I put into the Sixers (and to a lesser extent the Eagles.) I remember the high after winning game 1 against the Lakers- and nothing the Phillies do is able to spark more than deep respect- because I bailed on that franchise 10+ years ago (strike time.) While the Sixers I watch through good and mostly) bad.

Fact is, as an adult you typically don't have the time or energy to be fully invested in more than 1 or 2 teams. I just have the feeling that I picked the wrong horse.

It does become much, much harder to follow all three sports with the same gusto you did in your youth, agree with that 100%.

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Joe reply to tk76 on Oct 8 at 11:10
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I'm with ya.

I'm an odd ball though because I joined the Sixers about 2 weeks into Andre Miller's tenure here. I loved his game and the Sixers made a nice 2nd half run the year Iverson left.

They went from 3 to a distant 1 in a matter of about 3 weeks for me. I am only emotionally invested in the Sixers. The Phillies and Eagles I enjoy... but Roy's no hitter did nothing to me compared to Iguodala's 3 against the Lakers. I'm so stupid sometimes...

Let's not forget, the Sixers management has a tendency to do very dumb things. Big money on Elton Brand was required at the time to bring fans to the games, I get that - but bringing retreads like Eddie Jordan to this team and having a weak scouting department makes me believe they just don't care.

Ownership seems to care. The question is, what do they care about? They care about gimmicks to get fans in the seats (signing Iverson). They care about saving money (the Dalembert trade). They care about...hmmn...well, they care about hockey.

They care about what most corporate owners who answer to stockholders care about.

Profit

If they think investing more cash will develop legit fan interest (and help their cable network and branding) then they will likely go over the tax.

But it has been many years since adding another few pieces would result in a big enough bump in wins to generate fan interest.

You can be a profitable NBA team and still stink. It's easier to be profitable following the Sterling method.

However, how much do the sixers get from the local tv rights since ownership owns the tv rights? That's not an asset they have to sell for whatever minimal money it might bring in? The clippers may stink but Fox Sports West (or FSW2 I forget which one) still pays money to air their games.

It's a zero sum game, though. FSW has to pay for the content, Comcast gets their hoops games for free.

FSW pays that money to the clippers though, that boosts the clippers income.

No one gives comcast money to broadcast the sixers games, so that's less income for the sixers specifically. (I don't know how corporations such as comcast works that, maybe they artificially indicate a payment from comcast sportsnet to the sixers as two different subsidiaries. In the end it's comcast money but it's 'income' for the sixers and an 'expense' for CSN)

The point I made poorly was that the clippers get money for airing their games that the sixers (alone) don't. The FSW expense doesn't impact the clippers bottom line negatively

Comcast owns the stadium, right?

The accounting in incestuous sports relationships like this can get ridiculous. Like, when they sit down to renegotiate the CBA, the Sixers can charge themselves an absurd rent for the building and then give them nothing for the TV rights, and make themselves look like they're losing money hand over fist.

I believe comcast owns the stadium as well yes. In my 'fantasy' where I buy the sixers I have to offer comcast an obscene amount of money because of all the assets involved before I sell of the flyers and make them move to south jersey :)

The Phils getting high ratings on CSN generates income for Comcast and raises the profile of CSN Philly. They could make even more money if they liscenced the rights to CSN Philly to Dish, DirectTV and other cable providers- but instead they use it to drive Comcast's local cable monopoly by forcing Philly metro residents to give up Phillies games if they use anyone other than Comcast.

The same benefits would come from a winning/popular Sixers team, except they get it for free instead of having to pay the Phillies.

This separates the finatial adbvantage garnered from a popular Sixers tema as opposed to the clippers- whose success could never be as fully leveraged by Sterling like Comcast can.

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Rodney Buford reply to tk76 on Oct 8 at 18:54
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Verizon must pay out the nose but they carry the comcast channels - and it is glorious.

I think ownership cares on some level- given how many coaches they have cycled through. They also supported a top 4-7 payroll throughout the AI era.

I believe its more incompetence than anything. Look at the past 4 seasons and tell me they have not been blind?

1. 2007: team has the NBA's worst record and about to trade AI. But instead of going young and playing out the string for a shot at Oden/Durant they trade for Miller and Joe Smith... finsih off the year on a 22-11 run and jump into mediocrity.

2. 2008-9: They keep Andre Miller around until he can walk. get nothing back. And go into the next year Lou Williams and the youngest player in the NBA (who played SG/SF in college) as their PG's. They lucked out with Jrue being ready so quickly, but still, it screams incompetence.

3. 2010: After missing out on some promising true centers that slipped like De'Andre Jordan (and flat out selling the Fasenko pick 2 years earlier), they fail to draft a center in a year where 6 legit center prospects are drafted between picks 29-50 (and that's ignoring Cousins and Favors: Orton, Plieb, Pittman, Jordan, Whiteside and Alabi.) Ironically they get the #21 pick for Green, and yet still don't have a Center beyond Hawes and Speights.

And then there is their strange fascination with accumulating wings. Iguodala, Turner, Meeks, Young, Carney, Kapono, Byars, Nocioni, Jones and Rush have been the good, bad and ugly... and have represent the bulk of the teams draft picks, FA signings and trades over the past 4 seasons. That just seems like a ton of mid level resources, when maybe 1 or 2 project 7 footers would have seemed the wiser choice?

Turner needs to be a starter. He gets to the line, defends well, and rebounds well. Collins is making bonehead move #1 if Turner begins the season on the pine.

This has Elton Brand written all over it...

Via NYT:

In discussing the NBA's negotiation of a new collective bargaining agreement with the players union, David Stern emphasized the league's interest in giving teams greater flexibility to get out from under contracts that prove to be unwise investments.

The commissioner noted a desire to "come up with a system where teams are not doomed by their past mistakes for inordinate lengths of time, so the fans can have hope."


Read more: http://basketball.realgm.com/src_wiretap_archives/69463/20101008/stern_seeks_to_relieve_the_burden_of_bad_contracts/#ixzz11mlGGpUf

I forgot what hope feels like...

We felt it the day Jordan was given the boot. Lasted until the Dalembert trade.

Oh come on. You know there's a (largeish) portion of the dedicated sixers fans who gained more hope than they lost when Dalembert was traded and they still believe Hawes is better.

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Joe reply to Brian on Oct 8 at 12:53
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I'm jaded from that trade.

The Reggie Evans traded angered me. (I know most liked it. I still think it cost the Sixers like 5-8 games because Kapono is just so bad)

The Sammy trade was just ridiculous. A Carmelo acquisition and I'd walk away.

I guess a question I have is who is your backup team? The team you will quietly root for to succeed once the Sixers are out of the playoffs when they are 8-22 to start the season?

I'm thinking Golden State. I think they make the playoffs this year. Biedrins, Wright, and Wright will have to stay healthy though and Radmon will hopefully not stay healthy.

(I know most liked it. I still think it cost the Sixers like 5-8 games because Kapono is just so bad)

So you think the sixers would have been 5-8 games better last year with reggie evans?

My back up team used to be whomever ronny turiaf was playing for...can't do that any more cause, well, it's the knicks and that's just impossible.

Crap now I have to find a new back up team

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Joe reply to GoSixers on Oct 9 at 19:23
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Yeah, I do think that. Seems crazy but Kapono just flat out killed this team last year. He is just such a terrible overall player. At least Evans gains possessions for his teams typically.

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Jess Sayan reply to Joe on Oct 8 at 13:16
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Thunder

Now that's a bandwagon

I'm pretty jaded, almost never root for someone once the Sixers are done, I'm always rooting against someone. So I guess my team would be whoever is playing the Heat this season, then whoever is playing the Celtics, then whoever is playing the Lakers.

A couple teams I'd like to see do well are Phoenix and Utah. Phoenix, because I want Nash to get the finals. Utah because I like Sloan.

Like a true philadlephian...who remembers the t-shirts that said something like

"I root for two teams, Temple and whoever is playing Villanova"

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Rich reply to GoSixers on Oct 8 at 13:39
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Villanova would be easier to root for if their fans weren't either: a. the least knowledgeable hoops fans ever or b. knowledgeable but arrogant as they come. I still root for them in the Big East though.

It's always bugged me that Villanova was part of the 'big 5' (6)

Why? Are you that much of a stickler for the city borders?

Well I grew up on the main line but I always felt that around Radnor (hate radnor) or so that the main line ended and you were just too far away from the city to be part of philadlephia.

Plus i really really hate Villanova :)

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Rich reply to GoSixers on Oct 8 at 14:28
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Where'd you grow up? I'm from Lower Merion so I'm on the Main Line too.

Same place, near down the road from merion mercy

I don't have a backup team in this sport.

My backup team for hating is the Knicks.

Yeah, and I thought we got the better of that deal....

I still think stern is hoping for a year long lock out to break the union.

Here's an interesting question. If all the Sixers players crossed the picket line, and the other teams all had to use scabs, are we a lock for a championship? I say 50/50.

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Rich reply to Brian on Oct 8 at 14:16
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Barcelona might give us a 7 game series if we played them.

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johnrosz on Oct 8 at 14:51
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Demarcus Cousins was pretty bad last night. Fouled out in 21 minutes. 15 pts on 5-14 shooting, only 3 boards, had 3 turnovers, and was a -15.

Favors fouled out too.

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johnrosz reply to Brian on Oct 8 at 15:26
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I was watching the box score last night of that game. Did you see Blake Griffins line? After the first half he had 18 pts and 13 boards. Nuts.

At least some of the other rookies seem to be taking their lumps just like Et. Now we just need 1 solid showing from Evan and I'll be able to take my finger off the panic button.

Has Sammy D played for them yet. Or is he injured?

He hasn't played. Is he hurt? Guy hasn't missed a game in three or four years.

I don't know. I noticed he wasn't in the first game but I saw no mention of an injury anywhere maybe that just 'know what he can do' so they're making sure he don't get hurt (Or shopping him :)

Course, there's news today I didn't find yesterday

Day to Day with hip thing

http://www.cbssports.com/nba/players/playerpage/240280/rss

I hope he's used in a package for a blockbuster deal. That would be the capper.

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Mike P reply to johnrosz on Oct 8 at 17:40
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Evan Turner forever!

BOOO COUSINS.

Hawes won't play Saturday, I'll take any good news I can get.

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Rich reply to Brian on Oct 8 at 15:00
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You would think his gut would be able to support his back.

Anyone see Ted Leonsis' 101 things to improve for the franchise?

I am so jealous of the Wizards new owner. Night and Day compared to the Sixers.

How much of the Capitals success is because they drafted the right kid and mighty convenient that the new owner not threatening to move his team from their home got the #1 pick.

The NBA ain't the NHL - unless he hires smart basketball people he's as useful as jerry jones

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Mike P reply to GoSixers on Oct 8 at 18:55
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So you just said he was lucky because he got the first pick in hockey and forgot he walked into the exact situation with the Wizards and John Wall.

Even their first offseason with him was good. Stashed away Seraphin, got Yi, reunited with Gil.

You are a silly guy. If he surrounded himself with smart hockey people don't you think he'll do the same in basketball while doing everything to please the customers? They are already thinking of going back to the Bullets name.

He'll quickly become one of the top 3 owners in the NBA.

mighty convenient that the new owner not threatening to move his team from their home got the #1 pick.

Sorry that wasn't clear enough as it referred to the NBA #1 pick.

You think Gilbert Areanas is a positive on the Wizards roster?

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Mike P reply to GoSixers on Oct 8 at 19:41
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Oh I see. It's rigged.

Yeah, it was probably rigged. I thought you meant he wanted to leave and I was like "Why would Leonsis want to leave"

I obviously can't read.

But I am all for it being rigged for Leonsis. That team will get turned around very quickly now.

I think Gil will be able to play alongside Wall at his Natural shooting guard position. How many more years does he have? Oh man 4 more years of Gil.

That is an ugly contract. But Gilbert when healthy is an outstanding player. He's just had the worst luck on the court and made a stupid mistake off it last year. That year off is going to help him a lot.

Maybe if our owner wasn't such a dickface it would have been rigged for him.

Here is a VERY pressing question: which words that start with T are most likely to get a strategically colored/highlighted/whatever "*S*pencer *H*awes *I*s *T*_____" sign shown on-air during a game broadcast??

Notable preseason stats tonight:

Continued dominance for Blake Griffin - 23 and 9, 10-15 shooting. Could have had 30 had he made his freethrows. Aminu scored 13 but did so inefficiently. Luke Babbitt, 16th pick in the draft, scored 18 on 9 shots and made four threes. Shelden Williams had 21 and 14 for Denver, proving that the preseason is at least somewhat meaningless, LeBron and Bosh continue to play well together, Greg Monroe was ineffective, so was Paul George, and Wall was outplayed by Derrick Rose but had a decent game.

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deepsixersuede reply to Tray on Oct 9 at 7:38
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Aldrich looked like a solid role player for Okl. City against Miami with good screens and a couple of blocks.

Game on in less than 2 hrs. Or more accurately- game NOT on.

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Tom Moore on Oct 9 at 12:45
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I'm in Newark for Sixers-Nets preseason game at 1 p.m.

Collins pregame: "When you start trying to draw up a half-court offense ... When you don’t have a dominant low-post player and you’re not a great shooting team, it’s like, ‘OK, what do we do?’ That’s what I’m in the process of trying to sort through now."

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tk76 reply to Tom Moore on Oct 9 at 14:03
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Yep. Reality check.

big time

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Tom Moore on Oct 9 at 12:52
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More Collins: "We’re behind offensively right now. I think a lot of that is so much of our focus has been a defensive mindset and getting the seeds planted. What ends up happening is you go somewhere and things maybe you think might work with a team – you start running ’em and after two or three days you go, ‘This just doesn’t fit this team.’ You lose two or three days and try to find something else. Really, I’ve spent the last two or three days with my coaches just, ‘What can we do for this team? How can we help this team?’ Because we’re not a great shooting team. We’ve got to find ways to slash and cut.

"Our defense has to be good enough where we can get some turnovers, where we can rebound well enough to get in the open court. One of the things we’ve tried to do the last two days was practice our half-court (offense) execution. Because teams are going to pack it in against us. I’m hoping as we get acclimated to what we’re doing, our shooing will improve and guys will be more aggressive looking for their shots."

What I like in these comments is Collins isn't a slave to his system, if he has one, unlike the previous coach. He tried something, it didn't work, he'll try something else. This season isn't about winning a title so much as finding what (and who) works, so if they take a while to find the best offensive system, I'm ok with that as long as they don't try and fit the square pegs (players) into the round holes (system)

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Tom Moore on Oct 9 at 12:54
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Collins said Nocioni (sprained left ankle) would play some today after scrimmaging for first time yesterday.

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Tom Moore on Oct 9 at 13:16
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Sixers starting Holiday, Turner, Iguodala, Young and Brand in small lineup. Hawes out with strained lower back.

That's interesting, so Collins goes back to Iguodala at the three and Thad at the four.

Looking at the play-by-play, lot of jumpers in the first quarter, but night and day better than the other night.

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tom moore reply to Brian on Oct 9 at 14:02
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Collins kept saying Young would only play 3 in preseason.

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tk76 reply to tom moore on Oct 9 at 14:05
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If this was politics, he'd be called a flip flopper.

But I'm fine with him trying to find the best combination- although I want Thad to play SF.

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tom moore reply to tk76 on Oct 9 at 14:09
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I agree.

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Tom Moore on Oct 9 at 13:41
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Sixers up 24-15 at end of first quarter.

Spotty wireless - can't send courtside.

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Tom Moore on Oct 9 at 13:43
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Nocioni was first sub, with Williams second. Turner came back in and was paired with Lou in backcourt at quarter's end.

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tom moore on Oct 9 at 13:56
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18-14 NJ on boards.

15-47 1st half shooting.

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Tom Moore on Oct 9 at 14:23
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Yup. That's worse than 32.4 percent coming in. Sixers down 45-38 at halftime. Just 1-for-6 from 3-point land (Nocioni 0-for-3).

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Tom Moore on Oct 9 at 14:25
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5-for-22 from field in second quarter ...

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Tom Moore on Oct 9 at 14:38
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Could Collins essentially be asking for some help (i.e. a trade)?

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Tray reply to Tom Moore on Oct 9 at 14:42
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Who could we possibly give in return for this help? Teams want Andre but that wouldn't help. Some teams must be high on Speights still, I suppose.

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johnrosz reply to Tom Moore on Oct 9 at 14:46
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The last thing I want is for this team to try and make some patchwork trades to get veterans in here so we can be an 8 seed though. If they stink, they stink. Growing pains.

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johnrosz on Oct 9 at 14:41
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Looks like Evan is getting a little more comfortable out there

From the box, it looks like Iguodala asserted himself in the third. Sixers took the lead. Brand and Thad are actually rebounding now as well.

Really wish I could've seen what they did to defend Lopez, he's got 6 turnovers.

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johnrosz reply to Brian on Oct 9 at 15:01
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Really like what I see from Thad's line, most notably the 7 boards and 4 assists.

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johnrosz on Oct 9 at 14:58
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Evan is a +17

Jrue isn't really having the preseason one would have expected after his summer league performance.

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johnrosz reply to Tray on Oct 9 at 15:07
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Was about to say the same thing. Very strange. I can see struggling against Rondo but he should be able to match up well with Harris.

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Tom Moore on Oct 9 at 15:09
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Lopez had 18 points, but looks very slow -- methodical would be a nicer word. He's also touched the ball a lot because they run their offense through him.

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Tom Moore on Oct 9 at 15:15
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Collins has shortened is rotation, playing his starters 25-plus minutes apiece and only one sub (Williams) more than 14. Only eight guys have gotten in after half.

Turner's floor game looks impressive from the box score.

76-77 Anthony Morrow lost ball (Andre Iguodala steals)
5:45 Jrue Holiday makes driving layup 78-77
5:22 78-77 Terrence Williams lost ball (Evan Turner steals)
5:20 Andre Iguodala makes dunk (Evan Turner assists) 80-77
5:20 New Jersey full timeout

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johnrosz on Oct 9 at 15:17
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Elton's is 2-11. Yikes.

i like turner's iguodala impersonation. 12 pts, 5 rbs, 7 asts, 4 steals, 1 block.

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johnrosz on Oct 9 at 15:21
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Why is Nocioni on the floor. What has he done to deserve these minutes over Thad right now

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Tom Moore on Oct 9 at 15:22
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Yup. Iguodala just taken out. 20 points, seven boards in 40 minutes.

Really small group now -- Holiday, Williams, Turner at 3, Nocioni, Brand.

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tk76 reply to Tom Moore on Oct 9 at 15:25
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40 minutes in a preseason game for Iguodala?

Glad they have been monitoring his minutes...

They 'need' a win :)

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johnrosz on Oct 9 at 15:23
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wow 5 steals for ET

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Tom Moore reply to johnrosz on Oct 9 at 15:24
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phone home

Have a feeling that's going to become a standard tag line

Hey Tom, could you state how Turner plays? Is the box score a good indicator this time? Also how does this S5 looked on the defensive end?

very impressive rebounding today for a team that does not have a legit big

2-12 from 3. So what are they new, like 6 for 55?

Tuner 14/6/7/6

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tk76 reply to tk76 on Oct 9 at 15:35
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And team leading +18 suggests he meshed well with his teammates.

they actually won a game without having to shoot 55 % from the field. amazing.

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tk76 reply to zig on Oct 9 at 15:40
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Spoke a bit too soon :)

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johnrosz on Oct 9 at 15:38
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they should probably try to get ET the ball on one of these inbounds plays...

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Tom Moore on Oct 9 at 15:42
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Wow. Shot clearly good. Gave up three 3s in final 13 seconds to lose, 90-89.

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johnrosz reply to Tom Moore on Oct 9 at 15:45
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How many were because of our tough Argentinian?

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johnrosz on Oct 9 at 15:43
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I really hope this isn't a sign of things to come. Having Nocioni on the floor during crunch time, even though he is statistically one of the worst defenders in the league.

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tk76 reply to johnrosz on Oct 9 at 15:44
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No, Iguodala and Turner had already played 40 minutes- so Collins had taken them out of the game.

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johnrosz reply to tk76 on Oct 9 at 15:46
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Young didn't play that much in the 4th quarter I don't think. Not sure why Nocioni got any of his minutes in the 2nd half. Thad looks like he played really well from the box score

Great job tk76 & rosz et al - thanks

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johnrosz on Oct 9 at 15:58
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Not sure about anyone else but I found myself wishing that ET would get the ball on the inbounds over anyone else out there. I've got the most confidence in him to knock down his free throws over anyone else on the squad.

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Tom Moore on Oct 9 at 16:20
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Turner was in at the end. Young and Iguodala were on the bench.

Collins: "I was just discouraged for our guys. We did so many good things."

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Tom Moore on Oct 9 at 16:25
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Collins: "I just wanted to see (the small lineup) with Spencer out. ... It doesn't make sense to play our big lineup if we're going to big and slow and not rebound."

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johnrosz reply to Tom Moore on Oct 9 at 16:40
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Ouch. Not the best endorsement for our bigs

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Tom Moore on Oct 9 at 16:36
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Collins on Holiday: "He's struggling. I don't know if he's putting too much pressure on himself."

Holiday shot 2-for-9 from field (0-for-2 from 3), 1-for-3 from line with six rebounds, two assists, three turnovers, two steals.

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Tom Moore on Oct 9 at 16:43
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In three preseason games, Sixers are averaging 83.3 points and shooting 74-for-221 (33.5 percent) from the field, including 6-for-46 (13 percent) from 3-point range.

It still sucks but it's 38.9 if they would stop taking threes

20.8% of attempted shots are threes on a team with no 3 point shooters, that's just dumb

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Mike P reply to GoSixers on Oct 9 at 20:06
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Gotta institute the grand a three for Iggy and Thad rule.

Those guys shouldn't be taking threes, ever.

In other news, YAY TURNER.

BOOOOOO COUSINS!!

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Tom Moore reply to Mike P on Oct 9 at 20:21
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Holiday is 2-for-10 from 3;

Young 0-for-5;

Meeks 0-for-7;

Iggy 2-for-8;

Nocioni 0-for-5 (all today);

Williams 2-for-5 (only guy above 25 percent).

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Mike P reply to Tom Moore on Oct 9 at 20:41
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Meeks and Williams I am okay with shooting threes. One of the few things Lou can do is shoot tres.

Meeks should be shooting open corner threes. No idea why he is shooting 7 bricks.

Iggy needs to start getting fined though. 8 threes from him is ridiculous.

I am curious as to what these threes look like. I just imagine the offense not getting into place because we don't have one and someone just jacking one up.

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Tom Moore reply to Mike P on Oct 9 at 22:31
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Most, IMO, are ill-advised. Nocioni's were wide-open, but he doesn't have his legs after being out for so long with the sprained ankle. They also shoot too many long 2s.

Iggy needs to start getting fined though. 8 threes from him is ridiculous.

Not sure where the 8 threes stat came from, but I'm pretty sure Tom Moore was wrong. Iguodala went 2-3 in his last game and 0-2 in his first game and didn't play in the middle game. So, 2-5, 40%. No doubt, some people will still think 5 three's is too many over two games, even if he shoots 40% ...

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Mike P reply to Statman on Oct 10 at 15:19
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For Iggy, yeah, 5 threes is way too many.

It's kinda disappointing that a dummy like Josh Smith can go from shooting threes at an Iggy like rate and then just stop shooting them entirely for half a year.

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tom moore on Oct 9 at 17:37
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Iggy hit some jumpers in third from 16 feet or so. Turner played well off the ball. Holiday was quiet afterward.

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tom moore on Oct 9 at 17:40
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Iggy said he thinks the set offense is getting better and he is confident it will be fine.

I wonder how much better the Nets will be this year. It never entirely made sense to me that they were so bad last year.

Injuries played a huge part in it I think (devin harris) and then it's just builds up oon you I think. I believe if they stay healthy they'll be a lot better this year.

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Tom Moore on Oct 9 at 20:27
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Iguodala afterward: "You take some good things and bad things out of (today's game). Hopefully, we learned a lot. Our defense is going to get us going; that philosophy works for any team. We need to get better at communicating, covering for each other, and putting ourselves in a better position to rebound. We have some room to progress and get better. That’s what preseason is for."

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Tom Moore on Oct 9 at 20:29
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Collins: "It was a great learning tool. Better it happened now than in a regular-season game."

Hmmm, didn't see the game, but is anyone else a little surprised that Turner has his best game (that really includes Summer League too), when he finally gets his shot to play in between Iguodala and Jrue. Tom, would you say that he had the ball in his hands a lot tonight? That's an excellent all around game from him today.

It seems like Thad was excellent today at the 4, his rebounding numbers being good. We've all talked about Thad at the 3, but does anyone see Collins sticking with this for awhile? I hate to say it, but Thad looks like a good option at the 4 compared to Hawes at the 5. Besides one facet of their games, EB (shooting) and AI9 (passing) had nice lines. EB's rebounding was impressive. I feel that Iguodala's assists will drop a little with two other playmakers, but he had a real nice game today.

Negatives- The whole bench, Nocioni (0-5 from three, but he was tough!) and Jrue. What are Jrue's looks like Tom? Nine shots seems a little much, no?

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tk76 reply to Rich on Oct 9 at 23:29
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At least fro reading the play by play- there were a number of consecutive serieswhen Turner, Iguodala and Jrue generated steal that resulted in easy baskets. Hopefully this bodes well for the 3 meshing on the defensive end- which is every bit as important as their success in the set offense.

We talked at length about the defensive potential of this three last year even before the lottery. I'm not sure Turner's ready to be more than an average defender right now (although I do think he has potential to be one down the road), but he should be able to force turnovers and ignore the break right from the beginning.

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deepsixersuede reply to Derek Bodner on Oct 10 at 9:28
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With 5 solid guards our coach should spread the minutes around and pressure the ball [ 1/2 court area] for 48 minutes a game. It makes up for the weakness [ interior defense] and as an aside may be exciting to watch and put people in the seats.

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Tom Moore reply to Rich on Oct 10 at 23:25
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The ball was in Holiday's hands most of the time, but Turner did a nice job moving without it and he had it.

Have to consider Nets' motivation or lack in preseason vs. team they disposed of previous week before getting excited about any box score numbers. A 'beautiful football Fall Saturday afternoon' clash in Newark against unformed Sixers. Can't imagine Nets' juices flowing. Conversely, Sixers were trying to rise from two humiliations, yet ultimately didn't. Though Comcast-blinded, I see yesterday's game, including final seconds cough-up, as instructive of little but maybe a hint of the overrating of Doug Collins as bandleader.

SHOOTING guard numbers - 39 minutes, 4 field goals - won't get it done.

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tk76 reply to jjg on Oct 10 at 14:56
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I'm not worried about the coach's last minute rotations in the preseason.

Seems like the Sixers really tried hard to win this game against a team that won 12 games last year. And they STILL lost. Is it possible the Sixers may be even worse this year ?

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Tom Moore reply to Gdog on Oct 10 at 23:29
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Some of the Jersey writers were wondering what kind of season to expect for the Sixers after Saturday's game. It's still too early to tell, but looks like Collins is realizing there's even more work to do than he expected.

By the way, who was guarding Turner? Because if it was Anthony Morrow, that detracts a bit from the game he had. Morrow's a poor defender and gives up a few inches to Turner.

Hoopsworld article on Turner. Some interesting comments from assistant coach Brian James, but mostly stuff we have all heard before.

http://www.hoopsworld.com/Story.asp?story_id=17570

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T McL reply to T McL on Oct 10 at 12:34
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"Arguably, our best player is a point guard in Jrue Holiday, so Evan's going to play with him off the ball," James continued. "He'll have the ball in his hands maybe 30% of the time, but when he doesn't have the ball we need him to run the wing, guard the two guard, and attack the basket when he comes off screens and knock down his jumpshot."

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Tray reply to T McL on Oct 10 at 13:31
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Arguably our best player is Holiday? Already?

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tk76 reply to Tray on Oct 10 at 14:58
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Arguably the second best player for the second half of last season. But Iguodala is clearly the best player on the team.

I really don't think you can even legitimately make that argument. The kid has a ton of promise, but best case scenario, he's a year or two away from reaching Iguodala's level and the odds are probably against him ever reaching level if we want to be completely realistic.

I think he'll do it, but to say he's arguably the best right now is just absurd. The coaches are applying too much pressure with these statements, IMO.

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Joe reply to T McL on Oct 10 at 17:01
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Yeah this moron is an assistant coach... great.

He thinks Jrue could be our best player. That is just silly and stupid.

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Tray reply to Joe on Oct 10 at 17:30
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I mean this is kind of incredible, a guy who averaged 8 and 4 last season and hasn't even played well in the preseason is arguably our best player? What an awful team we must have. Personally I think his chances of becoming a top 5 point guard in the league are more like 15% than whatever some people think they are, but even if he was a lock to be that one day, it sure hasn't happened yet.

Fagan- "Andres Nocioni's game is going to become a fan favorite. He's all about playing hard. If you watch him for a possession, you see him seeking out contact at every opportunity. He's never missing a boxout, or not battling inside for an offensive rebound. He's scrambling on defense. He hit one smooth-looking outside shot, but he's still a little rusty from all of his missed time. Once he gets back into the flow, he's going to give this team a much-needed presence for about 20 minutes a game."

Even though he shot 0-5 from three, toughness! Haircut! Mullet!

She forgot to mention that he never fails to let his man blow right by him off the dribble.

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johnrosz reply to Brian on Oct 10 at 15:23
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"He's scrambling on defense"

Sounds about right...

Question: How is it possible to short yourself 12 wins when the player you trade away only produces 10?

Answer: This is only possible if the player you trade for produces negative 2.

Conclusion: Fortunately, as Sixers fans, this kind of thing would never happen to us.

When did willie green produce 10 wins in a season?

Not sure. Maybe in high school if he played in a crappy division.

Lol somehow I don't see scrambling on defense as a positive even though they list it as one, more like scrambling backward as his man flies by him for the layup. As for his much needed presence, I agree it should help us secure that lottery pick for next year.

In other news: It seems Brackins is now eating at Chili's as well. The front office must have recommended it when he asked about places to eat.

I like Fagan and think she does a great job, but I hope we don't get this BS with Nocioni the whole year. I'm no fan of Iguodala jacking threes, but he shoots well yesterday and his shots are described as forced and basically ugly, but Nocioni makes one of eight and it's OK because it is 'smooth.'

Yup I'd say his game is about as smooth as Argentinian facial hair.

Tough, chippy, plucky, gutsy, furry.

When eating in that immediate area, I prefer to go to Chun Hing. Actually, I saw someone we were working out there a week or two before the draft. I couldn't really tell who he was.

I am probably the only one watching preseason basketball today instead of baseball or nfl right now, but there is something inherently blissful seeing jason smith travelling and willie green airballing a jumper in hornets uniforms.

just a warm tingly feeling that i probably shouldn't have. regardless of yesterday's loss, no more GT green...

Yeah I'm checking out some of the Hornets game too. And on a more positive note I gotta say Jason Smith looks GREAT in powder blue. I mean really, really tremendous. :)


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