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Pressing Questions - October 15

Man, since 2006 when Iverson left, this team has no identity, no one to look to for leadership, and nothing to care about. This is pretty evident in the preseason. I follow this blog because its one of the few good ones about the Sixers. I started off as a 76ers fan, but only because of Allen Iverson. When he left to Denver, I spent an entire day deciding whether I was going to stay a 76er fan or whether I was really an AI fan. I decided the latter and over the course of the last 4 years, when rooting for Denver to Detroit to Memphis and then back in Philly like a good circle.

But now, the NBA has blackballed him and I'm trying to get myself psyched up for this season for the 76ers and its super hard when the team is playing like crap. I never thought we'd be the bottom feeders of the NBA. I also think it was stupid picking Turner. But we'll see. A this point, we definitely wont be making playoffs. I think we should really blow up the team and start over. And Jrue Holiday...welll...we'll see how he does with all this overconfidence that Doug Collins is putting in him.

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Joe reply to Raj on Oct 15 at 10:03
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You missed when the team had a fine identity. The team improved when Iverson left and Miller came over...

and what did that amount to? 1st round exits?

I'm concerned with Dre just as much as Brand. Dre has really just disappeared in three of the games so far. I know he's supposed to be resting but just show me 2-3 easy baskets and keep the youngsters composed and I'ld be happy. I haven't seen anything from him to show he's learned anything from the Worlds.
Brand is really starting to prove all the nay sayers right. I really don't think he has much left but knowledge to offer this team.
With that being said I'm sticking by my 45 win prediction. By game 42 it will be time to give Turner the ball and tell everyone else to get out of the way.

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Joe reply to KellyDad on Oct 15 at 10:05
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Iguodala has been fine his whole career. Worrying about the one good player seems really weird to me.

I'm worried because I'm expecting a break out season from Dre. He has to improve on his numbers over the last two seasons for this team to be atleast .500. He's clearly the best player on this team but he has to want to be better than that. He has to play at an all-star level and carry this team or I don't think he will be here by the end of the season.

What more do you expect from the guy to have a 'breakout' season considering he's one of the best at his position in the league already.

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Joe reply to KellyDad on Oct 15 at 14:25
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I'm not sure what you are expecting from him. He has already had breakout years.

To be an allstar he doesn't need to get better... he needs to the team to be better that he is on and he needs to have a higher PPG.

If you guys are implying that Dre can't get any better you're dead wrong. Dre can do anything on the court that he sets his mind to do. It just so happens this team really really needs a number 1 option on offense. Are you telling me Dre can't play that role and still be effective in the other facets of his game? I know he can. I've seen it. There were stretches of games in 07-08 and 08-09 that he was literally unstoppable. He just can't seem to put it together for a complete season.

re you telling me Dre can't play that role and still be effective in the other facets of his game?

Yes, we're telling you that.

You know how it's known.

Because if you bother to follow his career, back to college, high school even, he's never been the primary scoring option on a team.

HIS SKILL SET does not facilitate him being a primary scoring option - and yet people keep getting made at him for not being a primary scoring option instead of realizing all the things he's good at that a primary scoring option (say carmelo anthony who is going to get TWENTY FIVE MILLION DOLLARS a year) can't do.


He's never been a primary scoring option, he never will be a primary scoring option, asking him to be a primary scoring option is foolish, being upset at him for being good at everything else and not a primary scoring optin is asinine

It has nothing to do with what he can or can't do on the court. He just unselfish to a fault sometimes. I'm not asking him to take 20 shots per game. I just want him to simply be more defined in his scoring role. When the shot clock is at 10 seconds he has to want to get off a good shot. When the other team goes on a 10 point run he has to want to get a good shot. When he's being guarded by Marquise Daniels, a player he's light years better than, he has to want to take advantage of him. Not just get off 7 shots. I don't think that's asking him to do anything he can't.

It's funny, I think he's gotten more criticism for doing those things than failing to do those things over the past couple of years.

He's honestly in a no win situation.

Even when he did average close to 20 points per game in 07/08 (19.9) he was given grief.

15.9 pts
5.8 rpg
4.6 apg
1.8 spg

I wonder how many players in the history of the NBA who played in the league at least 5 years and 'qualified' for such things have that career stat line or better in ALL four categories (and aren't giant big men)

Here's your list without the steals/game in there (minimum 9,000 minutes played):

- Michael Jordan
- Oscar Robertson
- Jerry West
- Magic Johnson
- Larry Bird
- Clyde Drexler
- Havlicek
- Rick Barry
- Scottie Pippen
- Walt Frazier
- LeBron James
- Tracy McGrady
- Andre Iguodala

The list is smaller when you add in steals:

- Jordan
- West
- Magic
- Clyde
- Rick Barry
- Pippen
- Frazier
- Iguodala

Man, what a list.

It's true

Iguodala sucks

Who said Dre sucks? That's what you wanted to hear. Brian you even pointed out how Dre disappeared in the last two games yourself. Your best player should never do that.
It's great that Dre is on that list with those players but how much better could he be if he took 100 less 3's and 100 more free throws? Or 100 more shots from 8-10 feet? That alone makes him a better offensive player. Are you telling me there's no way he can do that without sacrificing the other parts of his game? Coach Collins seems to think so. I don't see how you don't think Dre can get better if he plays to his strenths.

I never said he was a perfect player and couldn't improve. If he cut out the long twos he'd improve greatly, the threes aren't really the issue for me. Personally, I think he should post his man up a whole lot more than he does.

Just because I think he's a very good player doesn't mean he can't improve. What I'm saying is that he doesn't need to improve to be considered a very good player, and he doesn't need to improve to justify his contract.

Then we partly agree. All I said is for this team to be .500 he needs to improve on his numbers from the last two seasons. The best player should want to control his teams destiny every night for 82 games. Weather it be points, assists or defense. Just do happens THIS team needs an offensive leader right now. Hopefully Turner fills that role long term.

No identity on this team right now! Collins make his work, put some young picies on the court.

I think Brand and Iggy no works on this team... so let's trade both before the deadline. Trade both in a package or not but trade them.

We need some big PF who can defend and rebound.

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76ciology on Oct 15 at 7:00
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Are we, dare I say, the worst team in the league?

I've caught a couple of the Cavs game this preseason and i thought that they looked like a better team out there. They are more composed and in synched.

Is it safe to say that the preseason have showed us how important good perimeter shooters are compared to versatile players and how overrated perimeter defense is compared to interior defense? If that's the case, then Thorn better have a plan for our personnel because right now, this team lives on it's versatility and perimeter defense and has set aside the importance of good perimeter shooters and interior defense.

Relying our big guys for perimeter shooting, on offense. And relying on our perimeter defense, on defense. Is a pretty stupid idea. We need to have a sound philosophy first before this team can get out this funk.

Pressing question of the weekend:

How long is it before Thorn and Collins realize that they are not going anywhere with this roster and make a few (if not more) moves? Before the start of the season? Before January 1st? Allstar break?

Also what kind of moves do you think they will make? Not what you wish they did, but what do you expect.

I think they will acquire a defensive oriented center (second or third tier one, not someone that will make too much of a difference) and will use some of the youngsters on the wing to do so. Also they will try to move Brand buy surrendering some of the youngsters, just don't know how realistic that is... To me Thorn doesn't look like a guy who will stand still for long. I expect moves buy the end of 2010...

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deepsixersuede reply to Xsago on Oct 15 at 8:08
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I could see Iggy being given a chance to win somewhere and giving this team a higher pick this season. A trade that brings 2 pieces here and clears some cap space; Iggy to Houston for Budinger, J.Hill and Jefferies [6 mill. exp.]. Equal talent return, no, but we aren't dealing from a strength position now.

As far as Brand's rebounding, could it be that at the 5 his main goal is to keep the opposing center off the boards and he isn't athletic enough to release on his boxout and beat our guards to the ball. By the way, how are our team rebound totals this preseason compared to last year?

I don't know what they get for Iguodala at this point. probably nothing unless they get in on a Carmelo trade.

I was not for trading away Iguodala for scraps... but trading away Sam with getting back a defensive center is effectively blowing up the team (at least defensively), and the team has a redundancy of ball handlers/slashers and a lack of shooters and defensive bigs. So it makes more sense than ever to move Iguodala. He has 4 years left on his deal, and it seems highly unlikely that the team will be a 50+ win team in at least the forst 3 of those 4 years.

Can a 27 win team really be blown up? First requirement for demolition: an edifice to take down.

Yes a 27 team can be torn down if the primary off season transaction takes away one of the better players on the roster and replaces them with garbage.

Even Dilapidated buildings can be demolished. Without a strong foundation all buildings will come down eventually and the sixers foundation (when I say foundation I'm not referring to the roster) is crumbling all the way through.

Tinkering with the windows, or the paint job, or whatever, means nothing if the foundation is weak. The building will collapse eventually, it's a matter of controlling the demolition or waiting until it falls on your head.

If a building keystone has initial carvings of SD, IA & EB, you're a long way from city approval ... shanty b-ball. Will loyalty-free Thorn huff, puff and blow "the house" down? Right now the organization is trying to play both sides of the coin by avoidance of articulating any firm direction. The top needs to make a clear and bold statement for everyone's benefit: EITHER we're serious about winning currently OR we're trying to develop a future winner with our young talent; our goal will take time. One direction negates the other. Clarity from the front office would probably improve fan relations. Movement of stagnating personnel would surely help. From the outside, it resembles a Keystone Kops franchise.

"Even Dilapidated buildings can be demolished."

Good one.

BTW, I think I'll write something along these lines.

In fact, if you think about it, dilapidated buildings are more in need of demolishing because they are so much harder to fix. You can try a patch job here or a patch job there but in the end the dilapidation shows through and emerges in some other places. A start of the art building with a small crack (let's say the lakers and derek fisher) is much easier to fix without tearing everything down than a 40 year old building with termites infesting every wall and cracked glass in the windows (the sixers, from top to bottom) even if you just spent a lot of money upgrading the master suite, the rest of the house is a disaster.

Ok, so the Sixers are a decided tear-down: Determining the employees - suits and athletes - who caused the delapidation/rotting and holding them accountable is your first move as you don't want them anywhere near new construction. But when the Comcast-employed, in good political graces 'powers that be' are a source of the problem, you've got a dependable problem. Aloof ownership situation by the local mega-company extends the Sixers' predicament.

Theo Ratliff, who finished '08-'09 season in a snit, was right. He saw the forest from the trees about Sixers organization. Too much cake and butt sniffin', not enough fight, down at the old Core States/First Union/Wachovia/Wells Fargo Center. Doug's tryin' but he wasn't exactly a tiger on the court defensively. If you didn't do it, it's more difficult to transmit it to others. And The Deciders fall for pretty players instead of tough ones and then wonder why the team sucks.

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Rob_STC on Oct 15 at 8:27
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That is the one thing that keeps me hopeful is that they brought in Rod Thorn and I can't believe it is for no other reason than we can't fail anymore as an organization. I would imagine that Rod is working the phones every day at the behest of his coach. I really don't no what is going on with Brand because he did average 10 rebounds a game in his career. I like our 3 smalls and the obvious needs are a big with a defensive presence and toughness. Somehow that is what they need to add.

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Jess Sayan on Oct 15 at 9:46
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Is there an EB buyout on the horizon? If not it should be.

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Louis Farrakhan III reply to Jess Sayan on Oct 15 at 10:14
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HINT: No.

At this stage, I think it is pretty clear that Brand was done once he blew out his achilles. At least done at being a top level NBA PF. Either the medical staff or the GM made a huge mistake by risking 5yr/80M on the guy. I could sort of understand his old team taking that risk built on some misplaced sense of loyalty and the belief in what he was/is as a player. Its harder to fathom why the Sixers would take such a long term risk when their team was so young and financially flexible at the time. If any player was ever more suited to a short term,incentive laden contract- it was Brand coming off his injury.

Of course I have the benefit of hindsight, but still, it would be like signing TMac or Yao to 5yr max deals right now...

Of course I have the benefit of hindsight, but still, it would be like signing TMac or Yao to 5yr max deals right now...

Eh, not really. Brand was healthy prior to the achilles thing. With Yao and TMac, you're talking about guys who chronically missed games.

At this stage, I think it is pretty clear that Brand was done once he blew out his achilles.

Here's the thing I don't get, why was he a good rebounder his first year with the Sixers? Both prior to the shoulder injury and in the few games when he came back late in the season, he put up the best defensive rebounding numbers of his career.

If anything, he lost it after the shoulder injury, not the achilles, which seems really strange to me.

Having experienced a number of shoulder injuries over the past few years i can tell you from my own experience that they leave a mark on the psyche of the person. It's not that you can't do the same stuff (like rebound), it's the fact that some moves with your hand (such as rebounding) resemble like moves that might result in a repeat injury and that psychologically prevents you from fully investing yourself in the move. Shoulder injuries are as nagging as they get. So from this perspective it's fully understandable how this affected his rebounding... But it shouldn't happen to an athlete in a major sport. That's unacceptable...

So

You're allowed to be human

But athletes aren't.

Good to know

No.

Basketball players have huge medical teams behind them, state of the art surgeries, psychologists, you name it... We don't.

And btw i don't blame Brand that much. It's the organization's fault IMO.

I had the exact same injury as Brand when I was in high school (didn't get it surgically repaired, though). Basketball was always the worst on my shoulder.

Basically, if I extended my left arm all the way and caught a pass with a little heat on it, the arm acted like a lever and the shoulder would pop out a little bit. I overcame it by lifting and building up the muscles around my shoulder, but for a couple years, basketball was pretty painful. It was my understanding that surgery would've fixed the problem as well. That's why I don't really buy the shoulder being the issue.

Most things don't run as well as they originally did once that are 'broken' and repaired. It's the nature of things, and many injuries in the human body, once you have them, 'repeating' them becomes much more likely. I wouldn't be surprised to hear that Brand is constantly dealing with some sort of 'remnant' of the shoulder,

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Jess Sayan reply to GoSixers on Oct 15 at 12:04
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This may be totally off-base. Brand had his first child right around the shoulder injury. I was always concerned because I think it would be really hard for me to follow the doctors orders of not holding my child for several weeks. Again, it was just something floating about my active imagination.

Babies don't really put that much strain on you when you hold them, i mean it's not like they weigh 50 lbs :)

I didn't have a surgery either but was told that even a surgery doesn't guarantee you anything. So i guess i have some sympathy about his problems, but the organization should've done a much better job IMO.

How did you do it?

I overslid second base on a steal and tried to get back to the bag before being tagged, but my arm was under my body. It was like one of those things that you'd think you can't do to yourself, but you can.

I actually got injured playing pick up basketball. I was reaching for the ball, when two guys from the opposite team just ran in opposite directions where my was. The shoulder completely popped out. The injury repeated itself 3 more times since unfortunately but is getting better now after a few years...

Did it pop back in by itself, or did they have to put it back in. Mine popped back in when I rolled over onto my back. Every time it happened later (had to be hundreds of times), it sort of slipped out and then back in.

They had to put it back in. It never, ever got back in by itself. Every single time i had an injury it was a larger scale one i guess...

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Jason Mess on Oct 15 at 11:12
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Who cares if we a really bad (I mean is it really that bad). As far as just about everyone says here we need a interior defensive player. One that we all hope would rebound too (might be to much to ask). I do not think we will get that player in F/A next year so why not the draft. If you are truly rebuilding you focus should be on developing the players you have and looking for ways to fill in your holes as much as wining. Now if we do go out and win maybe (also might be to much to ask) the F/O will spend some more money either in F/A or trade to get the couple of players we need?

Unfortunately, it's more of a gray area than that in the NBA.

You can do the things you need to do in order to put yourself in a position to rebuild, or you can do other things to try to upgrade/augment what you have. When you try to do both, you wind up locked in basketball purgatory, best case. Worst case, you wind up in worse shape than you were before with an even bigger hole to dig yourself out of.

If the Sixers really wanted to win games and set themselves up to maybe spend some money to augment the roster, they shouldn't have made the Dalembert trade. That trade made the team much, much worse on the floor and ruined any hope of cap space next summer (even if Stefanski didn't understand how much cap space they were going to have anyway).

So now, this is where we stand. No cap space next summer beyond the MLE (if there's no lockout), a roster that really can't compete even in a "make a run for the #8 seed" kind of way. A coach, President of BB operation and lackey GM who seem to think winning now is not only a possibility, but a priority, and some expiring contracts sitting around waiting to be put into a package for a moderate upgrade. It's a recipe for disaster.

Two courses make sense to me right now. Stand pat and take your lumps with this roster for the year or make a move that will make the team worse, but add young piece(s) and cap flexibility after next season plus pick(s).

I just don't see many moves out there that will improve the team in a meaningful way without making the financial situation worse.

Ugh, well at least we know Collins isn't afraid to make a liar out of himself:

"The most worrisome thing for us, obviously is the front line," Collins said. "We miss a lot with Spencer being out. Now [Marreese Speights] strained his hamstring during the game and Tony Battie [knee] still isn't ready to go. So we're hurting with a lack of size down there. It's good in a sense that we can experiment with different things, but our lack of bulk up front is really showing."

Kate Fagan just tweeted that they were running a first team of AI9, Brackins, Brand, Jrue, and Turner, and then Battie came in for Brand. If Battie isn't completely fossilized by this point, it's not a half-bad idea to start him, given what we've seen (or not seen) from the supposed centers on this roster. Is Dikembe Mutombo available? Hakeem Olajuwon?

Hakeem did look good in that video, but the Sixers won't carry 15 on the roster :)

Speaking of which, I love all the talk about Chris Quinn earning that spot. He hasn't appeared in a preseason game yet, as far as I know.

Wow, I glossed over the starting five in that tweet at first. Wonder what position Thad is playing with the second unit. PF, I guess.

There seems to be a good deal of friction between Thad and Coach Collins. I'm hoping that Collins' good communication skills don't get buried under an avalanche of frustration, because Thad seems to be in a fragile state of mind and might get disillusioned if his role continues to change. Who knew that Tony DiLeo was the one who could get the most out of Thad?

Could be a blessing in disguise when it comes time to make a decision on an extension.

Well I agree with Collins that Hawes, Speights and Battie add bulk that the other players lack. He did not say they added rebounding or defense- so technically he was correct. Unfortunately 'bulk' is not exactly the answer.

considering he's one of the best at his position in the league already

oh god

I truly find it fascinating that with so many issues on the team, so many players so far from being the best NBA player they can be based on their potential and upside, so many people seem to think the problem with this team is with its best player.

I suppose I should be surprised, but after close to 40 years of Philadelphia fandom, I can't say I am

What's your list of most unjustly vilified Philly athletes over, say, the last ten years? McNabb has to be #1, I'd rate Iguodala #2, with Abreu #3. If the current Phillies weren't so successful, I'm sure Ryan Howard would move up the list. And Ryan Madson for some reason has a lot of vocal critics on philly.com (who have been silenced for the past few months). Historically, I'm sure Mike Schmidt would have been in this category, as would Randall Cunningham.

On the flip side, there seem to be some Philly athletes who are immune to criticism: Utley, Iverson, Thad (except here), Brian Dawkins, Brian Westbrook to a large degree. Historically, Barkley and Erving, Reggie White, a few others.

You know, I know McNabb was good but he had his flaws, part of them were Reids fault for no longer running him. I honestly would put abreu at #1 because he was so good and SO villified even at the peak of his game. Mcnabb two and Iguodala at three, partially just because of the lack of interest in the sixers :)

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johnrosz reply to GoSixers on Oct 15 at 21:12
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Reid is the most unjustly vilified sports figure in this town in my opinion

My god, it's preseason! Before we bury Elton in the ground, can we at least let him play some games that count? This team has talent. Sure, it also has a few of the worst players in the league (Hawes, Battie, Songalia), but most teams don't have more than 7 quality players.

I for one am optimistic, and think the Sixers are going to surprise early. Looking at their schedule, I predict a 4-2 start and don't think it's unrealistic. Once the team gets a few wins, the confidence will build, and we will be a top 8 eastern team.

Or maybe not, but I vote for letting them start the actual season before we consider it hopeless.

No offense, but I think a 4-2 start is unrealistic, 8th seed in the east is totally unrealistic, i admire your faith in elton brand, but it's not just pre season that people are judging his decline on, he played most of last season as well (no it's not all Eddie Jordans fault)

Though I admire the strength and power of whatever it is that you're taking that allows you to be positive about a team with so many obvious flaws it's like watching Jersey Shore and thinking that those folk are fullbright scholars

I was hoping Brand's issues were motivational and a new coach, new page would mean more production, especially on the glass, but he looks like the same player out there from what I've seen. Maybe he'll turn it on when the games start to count, but nothing looks different to me at this point.

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Rob_STC reply to stoned81 on Oct 15 at 15:52
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Stoned,

I agree. Let's see what happens. I am sure Management wants to see and understand what they have so they can make moves as needed.

Unfortunately, for lottery purposes anyway, we won't be quite this bad. Iguodala hasn't played much and when he has he hasn't done much. That won't stay the same. We have to be better than Toronto at least.

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Jess Sayan on Oct 15 at 13:33
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The Turner glimpses make me feel much better about the team. I see didn't Toronto. The backcourt's numbers were impressive. Turner will gradually become more aggressive. Seeing the signature between the legs behind the back move allowed me to finally exhale.

"Between the legs, behind the back" ... now if he can master 'into the hoop' like Andrew Toney we got somethin'.

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Jess Sayan reply to jjg on Oct 15 at 14:54
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Haha...well that was the first layup ive seen him covert as a sixer that wasn't on the break.

Heh, we'll have another poll over the weekend maybe. 8.6% of voters thought 30 wins or less, 65% thought more than 35 wins just a couple of weeks ago.

I like how our team has it backwards. No interior defense and no shooting.

That is just funny to me that a group of professionals could get it THAT wrong.

Say what you want about Minnesota, but at least they signed a bunch of big men who can block shots.

Oh well, lets lose some games! Maybe this year can be the one for the big blow up.

Collins is losing my respect with all this flip flopping though. Hawes is a bum. A fancy nancy higher paid Jason Smith.

Thre's a lot of 'insiders' who claim they've spoken to David Kahn and has revealed his plan, and while they won't make it public they say that he does really have a plan, like 2 years down the road, and that when they know the plan they understand the moves and it all makes sense to them.

I find it hard to believe, but we'll see.

The sixers, they don't have a plan.

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Mike P reply to GoSixers on Oct 15 at 15:53
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I think the plan is just to bring in as many cheap potentially valuable assets ( Darko, Beasley, that new center guy ) and get as many high draft picks as possible until Rubio comes in.

It's better then what the Sixers are currently doing, that's for sure. The team has been playing pretty good since they stopped trying to force the triangle on them.

Maybe the plan is to get Pau in Minnesota to convince Rubio to come over and play with them.

PG: Rubio
SG: ?
SF: Wes Johnson
PF: Kevin Love
C: Pau Gasol

Maybe trade for Rudy Fernandez to play SG and get Jose Calderon as their backup PG.

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Tray reply to GoSixers on Oct 15 at 16:58
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Link to that. I've never seen an article stating anything of the kind and I read a ton of NBA coverage. All I've ever seen is people ripping Kahn.

Not in an article, on a few chats on hoopsworld. Not great chatters or content, but better than ESPN

The Sixers plan is so secret they don't even know it.

Brian, I sent you another article- if you want one for the weekend. If you have other stuff planned feel free to hold it for later as I think it will be a never ending debate...

Excellent. I'll post it late tonight/early tomorrow.

In the pantheon of sports journalism is their anything lower than "freelance blogger?"

Yes, Bleacher Report contributor.

Philadunkia associate editor

who dat?

Philadunkia is the sixers representative in the true hoop network - they're awful

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Tray reply to GoSixers on Oct 15 at 17:00
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I think they're alright. I was in Federal Courts class a couple weeks ago and someone who wasn't even a Sixers fan was reading Philadunkia. He said he finds the class really boring.

My next article will be in slide show format....

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johnrosz on Oct 15 at 16:31
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Elton looks like a guy who's finally come to the realization that he can't play anymore. That he'll never regain whatever he had before the achilles injury. He just looks like he's in over his head. He's definitely a stand up guy, and knows better than anyone how much he's let down the organization and his teammates.

Heh, Turner just responded to Bill Simmons' column today:

thekidet lol someone just compared me to adam morrison lmao..wowww

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johnrosz reply to Brian on Oct 15 at 16:36
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I like Simmons even though he's kinda got that weird prick vibe about him sometimes. I don't understand why there's a growing population that seem to want Turner to fail.

Everyone hates Philadelphia.

Yeah, but we hate Bill Simmons (i mean come on, he's such an ass)

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johnrosz reply to Brian on Oct 15 at 17:22
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Simmons seems like a guy in love with the Al Jefferson mold. 20 and 10 on a bad team, can't defend, can't block, can't pass out of a double team, Just collect points and boards on a very bad team...

No real shock he's salivating over DeMarcus Cousins right now

Speights?

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johnrosz reply to tk76 on Oct 15 at 17:41
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I'm not sure Speights can even grab 10 rebounds night in and night out. Zack Randolph is probably the best example of the hollow 20 and 10 in my opinion.

Maybe if you put donuts on the sidelines? Otherwise I agree that he lacks the endurance and motivation to grab 10 boards- even though he puts up good per minute numbers.

On the flip side, the only other players who will get any rebounds are on the perimeter. So that has to give him at least some artificial bump.

A hollow 20 -10

You mean how he hollowly led Memphis to respectability last year?

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johnrosz reply to GoSixers on Oct 15 at 19:01
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you're joking right?

When people regurgitate ESPN memes, I tend to mock them yes

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johnrosz reply to GoSixers on Oct 15 at 19:14
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You'll find nothing but effusive praise from ESPN writers if they get near the golden 20 PPG mark.

The 'Zach Randolph numbers are hollow numbers' is a meme that has been perpetuated by ESPN and others for years now. It's an argument I've seen applied here in regards to certain rebounds being 'not real' rebounds.

It's a ridiculous argument when a person has no facts

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Mike P reply to GoSixers on Oct 15 at 20:04
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People still think Z-Bo is out for himself?

He destroyed it last year. He is like Speights, if Speights didn't suck.

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Tray reply to johnrosz on Oct 15 at 17:49
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Sacramento's hardly a very bad team. And Cousins is still collecting points and boards.

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johnrosz reply to Tray on Oct 15 at 17:52
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How do you figure? They were as hapless as the Sixers last year.

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Tray reply to johnrosz on Oct 15 at 20:30
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I simply mean that the preseason Sacramento Kings, the ones who are 2-3, one of those 3 losses being a three-point loss to the Lakers, aren't a bad team. They're not a good one, either, but this isn't Jefferson putting up points in Minnesota. Sacramento has several legit scorers - Evans, Landry, Cassipi. To put up all those points alongside the score-first point guard Rookie of the Year and a power forward who's established a well-earned reputation as one of the more efficient forces in the game is pretty promising.

They were very bad last year. But the Sam trade helped them and Cousins should help. But until they show show they can win in the West, I still think they are a lottery team. That qualifies as bad, right?

That depends, a 500 team in the west could be in the lottery but they're the 6 seed in the east, which is worse, being the 500 team in the lottery or the sub 500 team getting bitchslapped by orlando/miami/boston in the first round?

Sacramento is a better team than the sixers, with a better future, and better ownership

New Jersey is probably better than the sixers this year (if they stay healthy) too (also better future and ownership possibly)

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johnrosz reply to GoSixers on Oct 15 at 18:27
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I disagree.It feels a lot bleaker than it really is right now. Favors looks like he is light years away from being a factor in NJ.I really doubt Melo is going to end up in NJ over NY if he has his way. If all goes well, the Sixers have solidified their back court for the next 7 years. They have a piece in Iguodala that is either young enough to keep if Holiday/Turner mature quickly enough to be a factor, or they can use him to free up cap space/bring in young pieces/get draft picks. I feel a lot more comfortable with where the Sixers are at going forward now that Thorn is in place.

I feel a lot more comfortable with where the Sixers are at going forward now that Thorn is in place.

Because Rod Thorn did so fantastically in New Jersey before he got pushed out?

The reason Rod Thorn is available is cause he did a crap job in New Jersey the past few years.

And I believe location more than desirability is why Thorn took the job. He didn't have to move

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Mike P reply to GoSixers on Oct 15 at 20:07
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Did he really? He blew it up and gave the team tons of cap space.

He left before he got to spend it didn't he? Those were some silly Billy King moves after he peaced out.

THat is basically what I want to happen to the Sixers, bottom out, clean the garbage out of the roster, and start over.

He just held on too long with Kidd, Carter, and Jefferson.

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Rodney Buford on Oct 15 at 18:43
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Here's my pressing question:

What would be the feeling on this board if we drafted Favors at #2 and he put up the #'s he has so far in the preseason?

Problem is one of expectation

Turner was a junior who was seen as "NBA Ready" (rightly or wrongly)

Favors was a freshman that people expect to take 2-3 years to adjust to the NBA (supposedly it takes big men longer)

Honestly, if they weren't going to take Turner, I wanted them to take Cousins

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johnrosz on Oct 15 at 19:01
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Does anyone know if GoSixers is JohnEMagee's new handle?

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deepsix reply to johnrosz on Oct 15 at 21:14
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yeah it's established

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deepsixersuede on Oct 15 at 22:34
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I haved watched Houston and Chicago in the last week and compared to our games the court looks so much bigger and spaced out. Thibodeux and Adelman both run nice looking offenses.

Is Jrue Holiday getting treated like Donovan was, no weapons to make life easier and show all his skills?

A solid game for Jason Smith vs Indiana.

pretty straight-forward trade for a big. Not too complicated. Tell me your opinion on it!
http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=2c4mfhy

Major thanks for the blog post.Really thank you! Fantastic.


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