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Your Top Five Point Guards: Discuss

"the final two spots will be between Jrue, Wall and Rose"

No Love for Rubio?

CP3 is my #1, I enjoy watching him play more than any other player in the league this year.

My problem with Rondo being #3 is that he's playing with the celtics witch elevates him to a whole new level. I think his lack of FT% and Jump shot would make it impossible for him to ever lead a team as the main star but that's just me. If you put wall in boston and Rondo in Washington Rondo wouldn't be considered #3. But obviously it's tough to adjust for all that etc.

My top 5

1) CP3
2) Deron
3) Nash
4) Westbrook
5) Rondo

No Love for Rubio?

I'm confused Ricky Rubio is Sid Finch - he's never going to play for Minnesota...why should he? (yes i know sid finch wasn't real)

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Jason reply to GoSixers on Nov 15 at 22:13
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I obviously can't for sure say anything about Rubio playing next year for Minny, but I think there's a chance. Regardless, I do think he'll be in the League in 2-3 years.

Chris Paul
Deron Williams
Rajon Rondo
Derick Rose
Steve Nash

Watch out for John Wall that kid is a beast

"If I re-evaluate three years in the future, Nash and Miller will be out and the final two spots will be between Jrue, Wall and Rose."

You mean, between Jrue, Wall, Rose and Westbrook. You forgot Westbrook, who's already a top 6 PG for you. Anyway, as they sang on Sesame Street when I was little, which one of these things is not like the other, which one of these things just doesn't belong. Wall already looks twice as promising as Jrue.

Yeah, I did forget Westbrook.

which one of these things is not like the other, which one of these things just doesn't belong.

Sesame Street teaching everyone to conform - evil Sesame Street

John Wall doesn't look twice as promising as Jrue to me plus he looks more scorer than passer to me, I like my point guards to be less Iverson like personally.

Keep in mind that wall and holiday aren't that much different in age

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Jason reply to GoSixers on Nov 15 at 23:22
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8 games in huh?

8 games in which Wall is almost the equivalent of neutral on offense?

Yes, let's make conclusions about a guy 8 games into a season.

Last year Brandon Jennings clinched the rookie of the year award after he scored 55 points according to some folks at the time...

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Jason reply to GoSixers on Nov 15 at 23:30
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lol ok. Then how can you say that Wall isn't 2x better prospect than Jrue. You say that he is too "iverson like" when he's only played 8 games, then I make a comment and suddenly you're back pedaling like "it's too early to comment on wall's game".

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Shawn reply to Jason on Nov 15 at 23:38
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Jason, I agree with you. I think Wall has potential to have elite vision, and take over games with his penetration and passing. A little like Chris Paul.

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Tray reply to GoSixers on Nov 15 at 23:54
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No, that wasn't Sesame Street's point. They were just trying to teach kids concepts, like vegetables vs. fruits. Birds vs. fish.

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Tray reply to GoSixers on Nov 15 at 23:58
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Also I don't see how we can knock Wall for being a gifted scorer. Like Isaiah Thomas was somehow a worse point guard because he led their team in scoring. Or like Paul and Deron Williams would be better if they weren't so good at scoring. Wall's already their best scorer, so he shoots the ball, but he makes a ton of plays, especially considering the lousy talent there.

We have to be sure Wall is a gifted scorer at this level. I'm not sold on his jumper and without it, the rest of his game falls apart a little. I'm not saying he isn't going to be better than Jrue, I just need to see some more. See my comment below for my main concern w/ him (along w/ the turnovers).

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Rich reply to GoSixers on Nov 16 at 3:26
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I think Wall might have the competitive drive of Iverson, but he really looks like a pretty pure PG.

"John Wall doesn't look twice as promising as Jrue to me plus he looks more scorer than passer to me, I like my point guards to be less Iverson like personally."

John Wall is very little like Iverson, IMO.

I think people underrate John Wall's floor game for the simple fact that he can score as well.

1. Chris Paul
2. Deron Williams
3. Steve Nash
4. Rajon Rondo
5. Derrick Rose

Rondo is the interesting one. I think he's #3, but I think he is the perfect guy for the Celtics offense, living to make the other guys better. You need a specific mindset to play with those three personalities/players, and he is the best fit in the league for that team.

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deepsixersuede on Nov 15 at 23:53
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I think it is okay for a p.g. to score, D.Williams has to for Utah, and Rondo would have to if he was here but they have to be able to defend that is why I am not a fan of Rose. My top 5 are Paul, Williams,Westbrook, Wall and Rondo. Wall makes my 5 because he plays both ends and if he was on the Celts I don't think they would be any worse than they are now.

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Tom Moore on Nov 16 at 0:15
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Turner 'lets things bother him,' according to Collins

http://ow.ly/3alXB

Rondo is definitely the wildcard. He's top 5 for sure- but he's the one guy who could really struggle if he was on the wrong team. I'd say the same for Westbrook and Rubio.

Do u guys really believe Jrue could be in the top 5 discussion? I believe his ceiling could be top 10 I think top 5 is pushing it correct me if I am wrong.

For me, yes. I think he could be top 5. I think he's got 20/10 potential with a 40% three-point shot and excellent on-the-ball defense. If he reaches those numbers, that's potentially top five to me. I'm probably more bullish on Jrue's ceiling than most, though.

Wall has been very impressive so far, but I need to see more. I'm not sure if he's going to be a gunner or not, there's a good chance he will be simply because he's going to be the best player on a terrible team for some time and he's going to try to earn the superstar label.

Here is my list!

1st Deron Williams

2nd Chris Paul

3rd Steve Nash

4th Rajon Rondo

5th Derrick Rose

Believe me Brian nobody hopes Jrue could reach that top 5 ceiling more than me but I just don't see him being better than Rose Rondo Paul Williams Wall Westbrook I think he can be in the Parker Harris Billups pack which is top 10. Hopefully I am wrong though and hes top 5.

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deepsixersuede reply to Marcus on Nov 16 at 7:43
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Billups is an interesting name because of all the Piston comparisons our rebuilding process seems to warrant. If our top level stars are here [Iggy/Prince?], [Evan/Hamilton?] and [Jrue/Billups] than who becomes Mr. Bigshot? Once someone takes that mantle, does doing it by committee work, than Collins can devise interesting end of game strategies.

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eddies' heady's on Nov 16 at 7:59
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As long as Deron, Chris Paul, Rondo, John Wall, Westbrook/Derrick Rose, and Kyrie Irving are in the league, Jrue will probably never sniff top-five. And if Lawson could ever start for a team and not play behind a stud vet, he would be up there too. Just like my long-held belief that Andre Iguodala would never become an all-star, but it was hard to convince most on here a mere two years ago.

Well, I did say there are no wrong answers. So you've got one guy who has played exactly one college game, against Princeton, and one guy who's looking like a career backup ahead of Jrue. Duly noted.

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Tray reply to Brian on Nov 16 at 13:32
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Lawson looks like a starter to me. They play better with him in the game than Billups. I don't know what about his game screams career backup. Certainly nothing about his game screams top 6 point guard, but he's not much worse than Collison. I think you have a tendency to overrate our young players. You were hugely optimistic about Thad, Speights, and really believed that Iguodala would one day attain a complete offensive game and accurate three-point shot. I specifically remember how you thought that the Iguodala of March-April 2008, when he averaged over 20 a game and shot the three at 37% (40% in March!) was the true Iguodala, the Iguodala that we'd continue to see in the future. And as it turned out those just happened to be the two best months of his professional career, nothing more. And with Jrue there's this similar, "he had so many assists in this one game, he shut down Westbrook back in the spring," ignoring that all the while he's been compiling an aggregate record that's good but isn't extraordinarily promising, and puts him on about the same career path as Collison, not guards like Wall and Westbrook and Rose.

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Rich reply to Tray on Nov 16 at 14:15
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Hmmm, I think Jrue has more than a game to go on. I personally think having even a Top 10 PG will be huge because the position is so deep. 5 is such an arbitrary number and a hierarchy can be created that goes more than 5 deep.

That being said, have you seen anything this year that rules him out of Top 5 discussion? Wall is excellent, but what will his aggregate record be this season, and Rose or Westbrook haven't been great record-wise, which really isn't important at this point. I think you might not even be giving Jrue a chance against some of these guys. He really looks like a better player when he plays against Collison too.

It's entirely possible I'll be proven wrong, but my assessment is based off more than one game with a good assist total or one defensive effort. And if memory serves, I believe it was you who said Thad would be a better all around player than Iguodala by his third year, not me.

As for comps, well we've got 8 games of Wall so I'm not sure how you can say he's on any path. He looks about like Brandon Jennings did this time last season.

Here's Jrue next to Westbrook, through each of their first 82 games or so. Jrue was a year younger and didn't have the luxury of playing with Durant, the numbers are still comparable.

The same comp with Rose. Again, Jrue was a year younger, again, his numbers are in the ballpark in pretty much all areas but usage.

I'll concede Jrue doesn't have the scoring potential of Rose, Westbrook or Wall, but I think his floor game is better and he's probably a better shooter right now than any of the other three will ever become. As for Lawson, well I guess we should only pay attention to how he started his rookie season and not how he's played since about February of last year. It's much more likely he's a 67% shooter from three, like he was during his unbelievable start, than he's a 28.9% shooter from three like he has been over his last 32 games. We should also pay no attention the pedestrian numbers he's put so far this season. Of course, the benefit of the doubt goes to anyone not wearing a Sixers jersey, so that makes sense.

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Rich reply to Brian on Nov 16 at 14:49
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I only disagree with Wall eventually having a better floor game than Jrue as he gets acclimated and stops turning it over. Rose and Westbrook are scoring PGs

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Rich reply to Rich on Nov 16 at 14:54
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Meaning I think Wall will pass Jrue in that area.

He could. I don't think he's there yet, though.

I didn't say Jrue would be in the top five, I said the last two spots would be between Wall, Jrue, Rose and Westbrook, imo.

Billups is hardly a stud vet at this point. He's actually not very good at all. You would probably be pissed off all day about him if he was a life-time Sixer :)

He was very good last year. He's been very bad through 10 games this season. We'll see how he ends up by the end of the year. He may be done, but how good he was last year, he deserves a few more games before we stick a fork in him.

Right now:
1. Chris Paul
2. Deron Williams
3a. Steve Nash
3b. Rajon Rondo
(Nash and Rondo are interchangeable- one contributes nothing on the defensive end but shoots lights out and the other can't shoot a lick but is very valuable defensively. Playmaking they are very similar this year. Toss up)
5. Russell Westbrook.
(He's made a jump this year. Been the Thunders best player.)

In two years...in some order...
Paul
Williams
Wall
Rondo
Westbrook/Rose

I think it's a decent bet to pencil in Jrue for 6th or 7th on the list. If he can become a Steve Nash-esq spot up shooter- 45%+ from 3, get a 4 to 1 ast to turnover ratio going, and become a lock down defender- he could sneak further up the list. But if you were to ask me if I would trade Jrue for any other PG's above, I would say yes to them all except for Nash because of age and possibly Rondo because he couldn't keep the same production on the Sixers without the same weapons.

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Tom Moore on Nov 16 at 9:52
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Video: Collins on Iguodala's health, not putting starters back in blowouts and other items

http://ow.ly/3azCf

Looks like Varejao and Mo Williams are questionable for the Cavs tonight leaving a starting 5 of Sessions, Parker, Moon, Hickson and Hollins. Let's see if the Sixers can handle that intimidating group of players.

1. Williams
2. Paul
3. Rondo
4. Westbrook
5. Rose

comment: Nash, Kidd, Miller and Billups are all terrific PGs. They are however significantly past their prime and i can't put them in the top 10 because of their defense at this age.

Wall, Holiday, Jennings and Rubio all have a realistic shot to get there. However i do think that a lot depends on the systems they will play in and the surrounding cast of players.

Rose is not much of a PG but was still enough for spot No.5. And Curry will be very good just not good enough for the top 5 IMO. With his defense he has to be Chris Paul on offense to get to the top 5 and i don't think he can get there...


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