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Setting Goals

There you go again assuming the Sixers can consistently beat bad team :)

The only tangible step they have made is starting to consistently win at home. And at least they have more home games coming up. But I don't see this as a team that will consistent beat sub .500 teams. Hope they show me to be a pessimist.

It all comes down to the youth, lack of talent and poor fit of the roster. The team is improving because Jrue is improving and last year was an anomaly. But they are more back to where they were in the Miller years. A team that can be world beaters for a few weeks in a row. But can also make you pull your hair out when they fall to the weaker teams. And I don't see this changing until the roster is revamped, or at least several more seasons of maturing.

I realize it's a tough case to make after that loss to Detroit, but prior to that, they hadn't lost a game they should've won in a month-and-a-half. And with Iguodala ou, I'm not even sure the Detroit game could really be considered one they should've won - on the road, minus Iguodala, second night of a b2b against a well-rested, healthy team.

Now who's making excuses about what is and isn't a win or a loss ;)

That's a game they should have won - they out played Detroit, Detroit is terrible. You gotta win some back to back games.

It was a winnable game, without Iguodala. The other players who should have (you Lou) didn't step up when they should have.

I'm not saying it wouldn't have been different if Iguodala was available, maybe it would have been, maybe Iguodala doesn't score as well as Turner and Turner doesn't play because Iguodala is there.

Point is - that's a game they should have won and they kind of gave it away. Coaching mistakes, player mistakes, they happen on not so good teams.

Think you're spot on. I could see them dropping a game to the Bobcats away, or the Suns of Grizz at home, but I think they're going into a good stretch and should definitely pile on some W's.

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Ryan F reply to Ryan F on Jan 10 at 9:20
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I have two lower level seats to tomorrow's home game against the Pacers if any of you guys would be interested. Face value is $55 I believe, would part with the both of them for $80.

Section 118, row 20 (I believe), isle seats. Can't make it because of work. I can meet anyone around the Phila area to pass them off.

The schedule certainly allows for this kind of a pipe dream. 6-7 wins at home are more than possible, which leaves us with 3-4 more road wins. 4 is highly unlikely but 3 is possible so this is not unreasonable at all.

However, it is very difficult to project a team whose best player is in street clothes, and is very likely to make a significant trade in the next month. Additionally, half of those mentioned teams will probably make significant moves.

All in all i'd say the more likely scenario is that they will be 24-26 (or the worse scenario 23-27) at the 50 game mark which is not bad at all considering how bad they started. I don't think the team can get much higher than .500 (without a major trade that upgrades the roster), which means they will gradually improve until they get there. For the full season i remain with my preseason projections of 41-42 wins, but that probably includes a very strong late season push (favorable schedule for the last 10 games or so).

you've got 4 losses on the schedule

Yeah, I know. Thyed have to win one of the games they really shouldn't to get there (2 if you count the home Knicks game.)

The problem is that while they'll probably win a game (or two) they shouldn't, they'll probably lose a game (or two) they shouldn't.

Maybe I'd have more faith in them if they beat Detroit this past Saturday, but there's just no consistence from this team in performance game to game, Iguodala will not be 100% when he gets back (tomorrow?).

That's how I see it

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Jason reply to GoSixers on Jan 10 at 11:17
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"just no consistency"


like Rotations or scoring?

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Court_visioN reply to GoSixers on Jan 10 at 11:50
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I actually see Iguodala being fine tomorrow. It's a few games down the line when I think his Achilles might flare up again. Here's hoping he stays healthy though.

Hey TK - c'mon man (ESPN said like) - you're the doctor, help us out with this tendenitis thing - or you got someone who knows something? Doctors know doctors, I know this my moms a doctor (or was)

More W's against lousy teams won' be of tremendous value to me unless Turner/Holiday backcourts are a defensive net positive during Iguodala's absence.

For the organization, I think the players and staff alike are trying to make a playoff run solely for Iguodala and Brand. I don't expect either to be shopped until at least next year if the win column catches up to their potential (.500 with the inability to close out games but competitiveness to hang with any team).

Does anyone have an opinion on the Raptors as trade partners? Their assets include a huge trade exception, Peja's expiring, and plenty of young (and mismatched - remind you of anyone?) prospects. I feel that Jrue would love to play next to DeRozan for 5-6 years, especially once he develops an outside shot, as he seems to be a willing defender with great physical tools. Ed Davis could be a potential Brand understudy although Brand may quit on the team if Iguodala is traded.

Would you really want to trade for another wing who can't shoot in DeRozan?

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Tray reply to Brian on Jan 10 at 12:52
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I think DeRozan will probably be a better player than Turner. And no, he can't shoot, but to his credit he doesn't try, and he still scores efficiently in spite of it. But I'd be very surprised if they moved him. Not that he's this untouchable prospect, but a rebuilding team has to believe in someone on their roster, and he's probably that guy.

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Cin reply to Brian on Jan 10 at 13:45
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As far as shooting from the wing is concerned, the impetus will always be on Turner to improve his touch (and likely form) from mid-range. Undoubtedly, someone in the Dorell Wright vein will create a better spaced, more dynamic offense that Turner has a higher chance to exploit once improved. Despite this, with the ability to nail an open look, DeRozan offers great intangibiles and could thrive under the tutelage of Doug Collins. I don't doubt that he will make a trey per at a decent clip down the road, if only to open his game up like Turner will need to.

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TruePhan reply to Cin on Jan 10 at 13:58
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Turner will never be a catch-and-shoot player. He's not a complimentary player. He's not a shooter. He is either a scorer or a point-forward. If you don't use him as one or the other then you better trade him before his value plummets due to being used the wrong way.

I don't see DeRozan as being a catch-and-shoot player either. He's a scorer too. If he gets played the same way Iguodala is, he will be very similar to Iguodala. Both players, and you can throw Turner in there too, shoot well only if they're not reluctant to and only if they're given the ball to go to the hoop or have it in their hands to create for others. None of those players are second or third options and if you use them as such (the way the Sixers do with Iguodala and Turner and would inevitably do with DeRozan), they are going to all play similarly to how Iguodala has played offensively and how Turner has played the majority of the time this year.

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Cin reply to TruePhan on Jan 10 at 15:17
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While I agree that Turner is best served as a point forward creating off the dribble, I absolutely disagree that DeRozan cannot rely on the catch-and-shoot as an NBA player. In fact, he has done so quite extensively for the Raptors and ranked well categorically by position in his one and done year at USC compared to his peers.

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Tom Moore on Jan 10 at 13:29
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Iguodala takes part in some of Monday's practice, including a portion of scrimmage. Coach Doug Collins hopes Iguodala will play Tuesday against Pistons.

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Tom Moore on Jan 10 at 13:41
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Video: Collins on Iguodala's status for Tuesday's game:

http://ow.ly/3Bktj

Collins' description of the play where they gave up the Daye 3-pointer was interesting. At first glance, I would have assigned the "blame" for that play to Turner, who looked like he just lost his man badly. But Collins described it as a "contact switch" play where Turner thought they were switching and Nocioni didn't. In this case, it makes a difference to know what the strategy was supposed to be. I'm a little surprised, though, that Turner and especially Nocioni have never executed that defense in all their years of playing ball.

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Rich reply to Tom Moore on Jan 10 at 17:58
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Really interesting Tom, these videos are great. I thought that Jrue probably should have cut off the corner better, that's the only real spot you can get the ball moving forward. Seems like a lot of people were at fault on that play: Turner, Lou, Mullet, and even Jrue a little.

I really like Collins' temperament. He really looks to be in full teacher mode, plus I loved that shots at Jordan he took yet again over not playing Jrue. Made my sports psyche feel a lot better that Collins is still feeling positive. The environment he's building (with the team really supporting one another and buying in) is definitely refreshing.

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Tom Moore on Jan 10 at 14:06
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Video: Iguodala on praciticing Monday and the chances he'll play Tuesday vs. Pacers:

http://ow.ly/3Blzg

This is a little bit late. I just finished watching the rest of the Bulls/Sixers game. After the Chicago game, both Tray and I discredited the offensive performance based on the fact that Jodie and Lou scored 44 points.

Tray Said “Now, as for specifics on why we're worse than this game, Jodie Meeks, who has played like he doesn't belong in the NBA for weeks and on the whole season has been pretty awful, maybe the worst starting 2-guard in the game, scored 24 on 11 shots”

I said “I tend to disregard a games offensive production when Lou/Jodie account for 44 out of the teams 105 points. I remain skeptical about Jodie/Lou producing like that in the playoffs.”

And while this is true, there is no chance that Jodie/Lou can be counted on to put up performances like this every night, it ultimately isn’t necessary. This team has 6 possibly 7 different players that give offensive production, and on any given night can lead the team in scoring. The sixers don’t need Jodie/Lou to put up 45 points combined every night, they just need a combination of Jodie(streakiest),Jrue, Lou, Dre, Elton, thad, and to a small extent ET to carry the offensive production for this team per night.

Even though Jrue has been very good lately, averaging 18.5 ppg in the last 10, he’s still not, at this point, someone I think can be penciled in to consistently be the teams leading scorer every night. But even though this team doesn’t have a consistent #1 threat, the sixers have enough individual talent on the offensive end that can contribute night in and night out that the sixers are able, and have been, keeping up with opposing teams offensively, which ultimately is all that matters.

Players that have lead the team in scoring this year.

Jrue Holiday, 11 times: Games 6,8t,10,17,24,25,30,31,32,33,35
Elton Brand, 8 times: Games 5,7,8t,12,18,19,29,34
Andre Iguodala, 5 times: Games 2,14,15,26,28
Lou Williams, 5 times: Games 3,4,23,27,35
Jodie Meeks, 5 times: Games 8t, 16, 20, 22,36
Thaddeus, 4 times: Games 9, 11,13, 21
Evan Turner 2 times: Game 1,37
Spencer Hawes: Game 26


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Tray reply to Jason on Jan 10 at 16:52
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Well here's where I disagree. I don't think we need 45 points from Jodie and Lou, of course. But I do think we would need something more like 36 combined from Iguodala and Jrue to be good. Currently we only have the league's 20th offense, so while we have been keeping up with teams' scoring due to our defense - our expected w/l is about 50% - to be a good team you need to do more than keep up. You need to outscore people. You need, in fact, to have a good offense, not one that's just passable enough to score the low number that you're hounding the other team into scoring. The 105-point night against Chicago isn't so much a matter of a couple guys scoring a lot; if that were true you'd be right - other players could take their turns on other nights, we'd still score a lot of points. What happened was that the whole team shot 56%. Usually, we're way, way less efficient.

Dammnit, why couldn't we have convinced New Jersey to take Brand ($35M next 2 years) while we take on Troy Murphy, instead of themk taking on Rip Hamilton ($26.5M next 2 years). I mean, at this point I think Brand is better than Rip plus New Jersey won't have any big men after they do that deal.
Dumping Brand's contract would be our biggest accomplishment this season.

Because they play different positions?

Because they don't need a PF?

Because Carmelo doesn't like Elton Brand?

Because the trade hasn't happened yet?

Because they believe the 'meme' that Brand is untradeable?

Reports are that the continuing push from the Nets to get SOME sort of deal done is not from the basketball folk (King/Johnson) it's with the owner who is 'hellbent' on getting Carmelo

That always works out well doesn't it?

Sooo...I know the deal hasn't gone down yet, but NJ will be left with Kris Humphries and they don't need a PF? Damn.

I don't care who on the Nets wants the deal, we could've been the 3rd team brokering the deal and getting rid of Brand's contract. IF the deal ever goes down.

YOu have no idea IF the sixers could have been in on the deal and Troy Murphy isn't the only thing the Pistons are rumored to be saddled with.

I would take Petro along too

So now Denver still trying to get Portland involved, they want Batum/Devin Harris thing to get done (where does andre miller go)

So four teams huh - that's not likely to fall apart

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Tray reply to GoSixers on Jan 10 at 16:55
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The four-team deal is likely to fall apart, but I believe a deal will happen because the three key players (Denver, NJ, Melo) really want it to. They'll try to drive the best bargain they can, and for Denver that means unloading Harris (because they really believe in Lawson, Brian!) for Batum. But if they can't get Batum, they'll still live with Harris, or get the Nets to take Harrington. And likewise, if Harrington is the price of getting Melo, the Nets will do that.

I don't believe Melo wants it to happen

I believe Melo's agent wants it to happen

This is a new agent that hasn't made ANY money of Melo yet. If he doesn't sign that extension rose loses quite a bit of coin. I think agents are too involved in making these trades work - they don't work for any teams - they don't have team interest at heart.

I don't believe Denver or Melo 'want' it - i believe that the nets owner is being stupid and that the agent wants to get his commission on this deal and NOT the new CBA deal

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Tray reply to GoSixers on Jan 10 at 18:28
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You don't think Denver wants to get something for Carmelo before he leaves as a free agent and they get nothing? Favors could be a really good player, and if Harris could be flipped for Batum, you have the makings of a solid young core. Melo cares about money just as much as his already very rich agent, and I don't think he's very happy in Denver.

I don't thik Denver wants to trade Carmelo in this format no - they are being forced into something, bullied by a player and an agent.

Harris won't be flipped for Batum

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Tray reply to GoSixers on Jan 10 at 20:03
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I mean... maybe Denver always wanted to keep him, but since he's going, surely they'd like to get a piece like Favors back.

PS - the most interesting name floating around in trade rumors I read today was David Lee who seems to have quickly worn out his welcome in GSW?

We should sign Joe alexander or Sean Williams

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Jason reply to Lawso on Jan 10 at 23:00
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Don't get your hopes up.

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Tray reply to Lawso on Jan 10 at 23:07
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What can Joe Alexander do besides dunk in the Big East?

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Lawso reply to Tray on Jan 11 at 10:25
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He's tall, strong, athletic, can shoot and rebound well.

Sure he can - if he could do all that why didn't he even make it through his whole rookie deal?

Getting to .500 by game 50 might be a bit of a stretch.. I think we get there right at the end of February; we'll get to 29-29 and then we will get to 30-29 by winning the last game of February

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