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Game 38 Thread: PHI vs. IND

This has to be an Elton Brand game. For all his improved play, he still only has 2 20-10 games all year. One was actually against Indiana early in the season. There's no way the shitty combo at PF for the Pacers can stop Brand around the basket. They need to go to this match up early and often, maybe even get some wise-open Jodie 3s out of it.


Iguodala is playing tonight, per Mike Preston.

But is he playing full strength or is he playing on limited minutes?

Rich reply to GoSixers on Jan 11 at 18:10

Doesn't say how many minutes, except that Collins will have him starting because he doesn't want him to warm up then sit.

Any one have any updates on Hawes and Battie (battie has been unavailable the past couple days - which i guess explains why speights is playing :)

Would you trade Blake Griffin to get Carmelo Anthony?

no chance

Alright, we're off. Hawes loses the tip.

Yahoo says the tip ended up with Meeks?

Ugly start, nothing but long jumpers.

Dunleavy up 5-0 on Jodie, both taking two shots.

I´ve got a question, if someone could answer..
Why not an old fox like Thorn, goes after Batum and try to sneak in the Melo trade ? Several reports before and still now saying that denver would trade Melo for Batum, so why not ? Maybe the Sixers could get Favors and possibly some low 1st round..

Could you explain how the sixers get into this trade - get nic batum - and don't give up jrue holiday or evan turner?

If you've read all the reports - you'd notice the ones that say Portland keeps saying no when teams ask for Batum - so what assets do you think the sixers have that make it more likely that they give them up

Now they get Batum and Favors - and Denver trades melo - WHY?

elf reply to GoSixers on Jan 11 at 19:39

I know Im gonna base my arguments over internet rumors but is all I got (Im don t live in USA)..
Sometime ago a report about Iggy for Batum and Przybilla being rebufed by the Sixers hit the net.. so based on this why not get Batum and then try into Melo trade.. but the my question should be formulated differently, Denver and Nets are not seen eye to eye in conversations, Im based in another internet rumor, sooo
why not trying to facilitate and get a peace to balance the roster, in the future for sure..


A. The Blazers seem to have changed their tune since Brandon Roy got hurt and seem unintersted in giving up Batum
B. The trade p Pryzbilla & Batum for Iguodala is kind of a shit trade
C. The nuggets want favors AND batum
D. The sixers don't want to take all harrington

elf reply to GoSixers on Jan 11 at 19:55

I know Im gonna base my arguments over internet rumors but is all I got (Im don t live in USA)..
Sometime ago a report about Iggy for Batum and Przybilla being rebufed by the Sixers hit the net.. so based on this why not get Batum and then try into Melo trade.. but the my question should be formulated differently, Denver and Nets are not seen eye to eye in conversations, Im based in another internet rumor, sooo
why not trying to facilitate and get a peace to balance the roster, in the future for sure..

Defense looks solid early, can't buy a hoop, though.

God, way too much individual stuff here. That move by EB was rushed.

Jodie's 0-3, and passed up a three for a long deuce.

Yeh, took a dribble in and was long w/ the shot.

Speights for Hawes really early.

johnrosz on Jan 11 at 19:14

Iggy does not look any healthier. Anyone else think it looks like he's running around a little gingerly?

Rich reply to johnrosz on Jan 11 at 19:14

Yes, I do.

johnrosz reply to Rich on Jan 11 at 19:16

he almost looks like he's favoring it more. saw him grimace about 2 minutes into the game

I have to take care of the kids, should be caught up on the game for the beginning of the second half. Sorry to bail on you guys.

Well, Iguodala didn't forget how to pass in transition. Beauty to Speights for the dunk.

whos doin color? def not e snow

Rich reply to joeykey on Jan 11 at 19:19

Jim Lynam.

eddies' heady's on Jan 11 at 19:17

Sloppy start, no cohesion or rhythm. Hawes sure got a quick hook.

Collins might want to tell Meeks to locate Dunleavy on defense. He looks like he's got the completely wide-open catch and shoot jumpers down.

I wouldn't mind Turner getting extended minutes here. Meeks doesn't look like he has it tonight.

eddies' heady's on Jan 11 at 19:23

In addition to looking gimpy, Dre looks winded already.

nice look iguodala!

dude is awesome

Iguodala sits, he had some nice passes and some good D, but he did look hesitant shooting the ball.

Alright, Jodie knocks down a 3.

i know it's early, but the pacers are looking pretty beatable, if we play sixer-ball

Iguodala and Holiday dishing, a thing of beauty.

Nocioni's defense is embarrassing on Dunleavy, then a dribble drive from him. Beautiful.

Turner's in for him now.

Nocioni's defense is embarrassing

eddies' heady's on Jan 11 at 19:31

Noc wasn't doing any better on Dunleavy than Jodie, so he get the quick hook for ET.

Lou handles the ball at the end of the quarter, bad pass to Thad after dribbling the air out of the ball. Shot-clock violation. Beautiful.

eddies' heady's reply to Rich on Jan 11 at 19:36

And on those end plays he always seems to pull up and make himself a jump shooter instead of continuing to attack.

johnrosz on Jan 11 at 19:33

can't stand Nocioni

Good TO, Doug. No energy tonight. He's gonna get Jrue back in (either for Jodie or Lou), and Jrue's gonna have to start being aggressive.

Speights has been bad on defense tonight. He just let Hibbert slip right to the rim and has let a bunch of offensive rebounds.

eddies' heady's on Jan 11 at 19:39

Jrue w/ the quick decision to attack after receiving the pass on post-up on Ford. More of that.

JTI here, by the way.

eddies' heady's on Jan 11 at 19:40

And with that said, Speights just watches Granger attack the rim right in front of him. No contest, no foul, ugh.

Alright, Brand's coming in, hopefully for Speights. Let's see if we can make some headway with this lineup: Jrue, Turner, Iguodala, Thad, Brand.

So i'm listening to 710ESPN.com radio from LA because I got so sick of 97.5 after a day and half - i tried but misanelli is an utter douche.

Jeannie Buss calls in often before games - calls in sick - so they create a contst at that moment and 3 listeners just got courtside laker seats

Keep attacking, Jrue.

Turner for three, rattled around, but it dropped.

The whole front-line has been horrendous on the D glass tonight. Thad just let up 2 in a row, and now he's got three.

Jrue with the nifty ball fake. He's scoring the ball well again tonight when he gets deep into the lane.

johnrosz on Jan 11 at 19:52

Meeks is doing a terrible job navigating the screens on defense. he's gotten himself rubbed out 2 or 3 times

eddies' heady's on Jan 11 at 19:55

ET with a nice fake-cut to the right and then cut back to left for the give and go from EB for layup.

Turner's been good so far tonight. Really needed quality minutes from him after the slow start.

johnrosz on Jan 11 at 19:55

nifty cut by ET. think he got fouled there too

Evan Turner is trying to get his edge back.

johnrosz on Jan 11 at 19:57

is Jodie Meeks the new Willie Green? I can't see why he's still out there...

eddies' heady's reply to johnrosz on Jan 11 at 19:59

your other option is Lou...

OK, I'm caught up. Jrue is looking good. Loved that give-and-go, Turner, Brand Turner for the layup. Loved the fake by Jrue on the break. They were getting killed on the defensive glass early, but fixed that.

Odd, odd rotations by Collins so far.

Come on, Brand. He doesn't put a body on Foster and it ends up a three for Granger.

Fuck. I hate those threes off offensive boards. Iguodala was there, too. Granger just got it off super-quick. Meeks needs to abandon that stupid drive.

Horrible defensive first half. Just horrible.

PHI 49, IND 57

Defense/Rebounding has to get better if they are going to win this one. That is all.

johnrosz on Jan 11 at 20:04

Iguodala looks worse off than he did before the rest

Rich reply to johnrosz on Jan 11 at 20:05

Little bit of that might be rust.

Old School Sixer Fan on Jan 11 at 20:06

They sure looked terrible finishing that quarter

Dre looked like he had no lift at all. Nice 2nd straight game from ET is encouraging.

johnrosz on Jan 11 at 20:06

I can't believe Meeks got that many minutes. Lit up by Mike Dunleavy? And 1 of 6 on the other end

eddies' heady's on Jan 11 at 20:06

The last several games every team we play seems to shoot the lights out against us. Pacers shooting over 50% in this half. The defense is sporadic at times but sometimes it's just the opponent making tough shots/jumpers.

Old School Sixer Fan on Jan 11 at 20:07

Poor offense and defense down the stretch. Iguodala really looks slow and rusty.

OK, Lou at the point was terrible. I'm not sure how they can't stick with Dunleavy. Defensive rebounding was pitiful.

Anyone know what the deal was with Hawes. Was Collins just pissed about that silly turnover and the bad defense/rebounding? Or was it an injury?

eddies' heady's reply to Brian on Jan 11 at 20:11

I was just speculating it had to be an injury. I mean, he only was out there 4 minutes.

Oh, and Iguodala doesn't look anything like himself. Crossing my fingers that it's just rust, he wasn't this bad prior to missing the games.

eddies' heady's on Jan 11 at 20:12

Sure Dre is rusty which is to be expected, but if he looks like this I'm not sure he's really helping us on either end.

johnrosz on Jan 11 at 20:13

I like the way Evan is playing. Probably deserves to start the 2nd half in Meeks spot. But I don't think Doug has changed the lineup at the half once all season

eddies' heady's reply to johnrosz on Jan 11 at 20:14

Yeah, he did it one time I think just can't remember who.

Pretty sure he yanked Hawes at the start of the third, can't remember when.

eddies' heady's reply to Brian on Jan 11 at 20:20

Yep, that's right and he started Battie.

johnrosz on Jan 11 at 20:14

I like the way Evan is playing. Probably deserves to start the 2nd half in Meeks spot. But I don't think Doug has changed the lineup at the half once all season

Holy crap, Indy hasn't attempted a single free throw, and they're up 8 at the half. You know the refs are informed of discrepancies like that, if they start swinging some borderline calls the other way in the second half, this is going to be a serious uphill battle.

johnrosz reply to Brian on Jan 11 at 20:19

it's hard to make contact calls around the rim when our bigs aren't even in the picture.

johnrosz on Jan 11 at 20:17

it was funny when Meredith Beastmodeavits was doing her little sideline segment on Mo Speights improved play. All while he's getting lit up on the defensive end and looks completely worthless

If Speights is worthless, what does that make Hawes?

I sure hope they wake up and pull this game out. back to back losses to Detroit and Indiana (both coming in with huge losing streaks) makes even me downgrade my evaluation of the team. And I'm harder on them then 95% of the posters here.

They really are making every shot.

Hawes shouldn't get in this game again.

Great fucking start to the third.

Hawes should be sat for the rest of the fucking game. God damnit.

eddies' heady's on Jan 11 at 20:22

Sheesh, what a freakin start.....

eddies' heady's on Jan 11 at 20:24

What did Hawes even do for that T?

Complained after making a terrible post move.

Make Hawes walk hone.

eddies' heady's on Jan 11 at 20:25

Can the Sixers team from Friday night vs the Bulls step in the building please?

Sweet timeout Hibbert, they have one second left on the clock.

johnrosz on Jan 11 at 20:26

Collison touched that ball while out of bounds

No way this Sixer team is a notch above the other borderline playoff teams.

Rich reply to tk76 on Jan 11 at 20:27

When Iguodala isn't healthy like tonight, then no.

Finally a good defensive possession, now string a couple more together.

There we go. Now win the jump.

Can somebody show Hawes where the weightroom is?

johnrosz reply to KellyDad on Jan 11 at 20:29

show Lou and Speights as well

If you bump Hawes in the post the ball never gets above his shoulders. He had no upperbody strength at all.

That was great D by Iguodala. He covered Hansbrough and Granger on that play.

Jrue for three. let's fucking go.

Nice run, again, starts on the defensive end.

Jodie and Jrue making shots.

eddies' heady's on Jan 11 at 20:29

Let's go. 6 pt game. Lock up on D!

It starts with fucking defense. Thank you.

Indiana- showing why they stink. They get a lead and then completely let down... never seen that before :)

The run started w/ a Collins timeout. Let's see if O'Brien can pull some strings. I hope Collins is all over them again. The defense we just saw should be the norm, it shouldn't be a reaction to the coach flipping out and a 15-point deficit.

Alright, I'll give in, Iguodala does look worse than before the injuries.

How great would it be for Collins to get through to Speights... but its only a dream.

jkay reply to tk76 on Jan 11 at 20:35

by getting though you mean playing acceptable defense, shooting less and rebounding like crazy; its still possible.

Fucking bank shot. BS.

Shit, that was a great defensive possession. Hansbrough has no touch whatsoever. Just banked it in.

No we're making shots.

eddies' heady's on Jan 11 at 20:35


oh hey guys, sorry i haven't commented since the 1st quarter, i was just chatting with hot babes on the internet. don't be jealous.

jrue and brand looking GOOD

Jrue- best player on the floor (again.)

Come on Jrue, carry them.

He missed that shot, but I'm loving the way Turner's playing. Getting to his spots comfortably.

Ugh. How do you lose Foster?

Ugh. Come on, back to six. Let's not end this quarter on a shitty note.

Jrue better be back at the start of the 4th.

Really, every time the game gets close Indiana asserts themselves and looks to be the superior team. Which is wrong, I know.

Thad looked like he saved that ball.

Ugh. Lou in for Jrue for the final 3 minutes. I hate that shit.

eddies' heady's on Jan 11 at 20:43

Damn Lou, high pick and roll and he's open for a drive or better yet a J and he still pump fakes and makes the shot harder.

Man, I fucking hate Lou sometimes (OK, most of the time).


They do not deserve to win this game with their defense. How does Foster get free like that by just slipping a screen.

sweet drive ET

Nice drive by Turner, should be a two-for-one.

eddies' heady's on Jan 11 at 20:45

And then he shoots one in rhythm and he sinks it. Stop faking Lou!

ET with the drive.

Uh-oh, a Lou iso at end of quarter. No, ends in a Thad handoff from EB for a banker.

We just need Jrue to bring us home this quarter.

Good finish to the 3rd.

How many times tonight have we seen Indiana assert themselves when the game is close... then they let down and the Sixer make a run to make it close again.

Sad to think of Indiana of all teams "toying with" the Sixers. But maybe they get burned and the Sixers take command in the 4th.

That's an interesting way to look at it. I see the Sixers defensive intensity as waxing and waning.

Better end to the third:

PHI 81, IND 84

Lou is begging for calls, and they just aren't going to come on these BS shots. Not w/ this huge FT disparity.

Speights SPLAT!!!

Heh. Speights draws two charges!


Nice iso play for Thad, rather he would attack Hibbert than shoot a stepback J.

Hansbrough is a fouling machine, huh?

eddies' heady's on Jan 11 at 20:52

Thad? WTF? Happy feet....

Dammit Iggy finally made a shot too on that travel.

They are the All-Varajo team tonight...

Indy imploding here. We need to step on the gas.

How Lou is handling the ball with Jrue in the game is beyond me.

Had the exact same thought. Pretty setup, Turner to Thad. IF that was a clean block, it was superb. Looked like a pretty hard foul to me.

Nice look by Turner, better swat by Rush.

johnrosz on Jan 11 at 20:54

loving ET's floor game tonight

bebopdeluxe on Jan 11 at 20:55

Sweet look by Turner there.

He is SUCH a different player when the game slows down for him and he plays with confidence.

LWill...lookin good buddy.

eddies' heady's on Jan 11 at 20:56

Lou w/ another one in rhythm and no pump fake.

At least Lou is knocking down that baseline jumper. Collins realized it, exploited it.

bebopdeluxe on Jan 11 at 20:58

HORRENDOUS shot by Jrue.

How close is Jrue to a triple-doub


They're getting bogged down because the guy running the point can't run the point.

2 terrible shots by Jrue and Lou.

eddies' heady's on Jan 11 at 20:59

Damn, up 3, but a Jrue airball and a Lou from almost 4 ft behind the arc. they score multiple times and take the lead. arrgggh


bebopdeluxe on Jan 11 at 21:00

Shot selection MUST get better. They can get that shit anytime they want.

johnrosz on Jan 11 at 21:00

give the ball to ET

Worse was that on that Jrue airball, Speights was wide open cutting to the basket at the beginning on the possession.

Having Lou run the point would be like having AAI be the point and Eric Snow playing SG.

bebopdeluxe on Jan 11 at 21:02

Good...get EB back in there. Thad with the easy hoop.

I love that Iguodala is in to stop Granger. I hate that it's for Turner, and not Lou.

bebopdeluxe reply to Rich on Jan 11 at 21:04

When Turner is as assertive with his offense as Lou is, then he'll stay in there in that situation.

When Lou plays defense better than a piece of wet toilet paper - let us know

And remember coach collins said play defense or don't play

bebopdeluxe reply to GoSixers on Jan 11 at 21:29

Sorry, jem...I was not advocating for Lou there...all that I was saying (obviously very poorly) is that for Turner to stay in the lineup late in the game, he needs to look for his shot - not swing the ball from the wing 25 feet from the basket. If he looks to SCORE THE BALL (which you KNOW Lou will do), then all of the other things he brings to the table (defense and the like) will keep him on the floor.

In a team devoid of finishers, Lou is in late BY DEFAULT. Turner can be that guy (I hope...I PRAY), but he's not that guy yet.

Jrue went cold. look for thad!!

I'm hoping that three was partially blocked.

Jrue needs to be on the ball here. This is silly.

Jrue went cold. look for thad!!

eddies' heady's on Jan 11 at 21:03

Granger to Jrue: "shut the fuck up man."

Jrue has gone totally cold

eddies' heady's on Jan 11 at 21:04

Good look Dre! Had ET running the wing or Jodie spotting up for three and pick Jodie!

iguodala just straight up shutting down granger. then he tried to take it out on jrue by whining.

BIG three for Meeks.

eddies' heady's on Jan 11 at 21:05

Freak....o-board for a Granger 3

Another fucking o-board three.

Great, that's fucking great. Offensive board for a Granger three.

Someone needs to punch Foster.

They swallowing the whistles now. AI9 got raped under the basket.

pacers are trying to body-up and get tough. its fun to watch the sixers respond to that type of play.

Why is their last 5 minutes of the game offense so stagnant every night?


johnrosz on Jan 11 at 21:07

stuck with Lou way too long and it cost them...come on Doug

16/7/8 for Jrue, now.

tk76 reply to Brian on Jan 11 at 21:09

He needs to be running the offense. Not this horrible iso crap.

Anyone else fearing the devastating close finish loss? I can't take two in a row.


Wow, Jrue pulled that one out of nowhere.

Shit, was his foot on the line?

Yes Jrue.

small ball

Now they're scoring too easily. Not going to win this w/out defense.

bebopdeluxe reply to Brian on Jan 11 at 21:12

They've been scoring too easily most of the game.

eddies' heady's on Jan 11 at 21:11

Doug has to put Lou at the two here. Damn, Doug, what's up with that?

Pacers shotmaking has been incredible. Hibbert with a terrible hook that drops.

That was a joke, the two previous were easy looks. Fuck me.

johnrosz on Jan 11 at 21:12

how many games does Lou have to lose for this team late before they stop giving him minutes in crunch time

The same was said for willie green year after year after year

Jrue, Meeks/Turner, Iggy, Thad, Brand should be the lineup.
Sadly Lou is in there.

Not gonna win a game when the opposition scores on every possession. Especially in the fourth.

Why not go to Jrue in the post?

tk76 reply to tk76 on Jan 11 at 21:14

Of course, once Lou is in they no longer have the Jrue-Collison match-up to exploit in the post... not that they ever do.

bebopdeluxe on Jan 11 at 21:14

Collison basically owning Jrue right now.

I'm loving the way Jrue is playing, but Collison is operating the P and R comfortably.

bebopdeluxe reply to Rich on Jan 11 at 21:18


Collison having his way with Jrue on the floor.

With the exception of the 3 at the buzzer, Jrue's shot selection in the guts of the game has been crappy.

TERRIBLE foul with 5 seconds on the clock.

I love Jrue...and he has had some moments tonight...but not in the guts of the game.

You are being too hard on him. The foul and the step-back three were really bad, but he was their best player tonight.

My point was that I liked the way he was playing offensively, but Collison was hurting him. The shot selection was a product of playing with Lou dribbling the air out of the ball.

Collison had his way on the P and R, but that's a team thing, not even close to all of it on Jrue. It's not Jrue's fault that he gets an assist for hitting a wide open Foster walking down the lane.

bebopdeluxe reply to Rich on Jan 11 at 21:32

I think that Jrue is a fine player...but to be a GREAT player, he need to raise the level of his game (both physically and mentally) at crunch time. He didn't tonight. He's only 20. He'll get there.

But he wasn't there tonight. That's all.

I totally agree that he needs to get better mentally, and he does stuff that makes you scratch your head all the time. After I cool off though, he's still 20 and learning. It'll come.

I also agree that he's gotta get better closing games, but a huge part of his mindset at the end of games is damaged because Lou and Iguodala are given the ball. He needs to have the keys like the rest of the game to raise his level.

I knew we should have picked Favors... This one game that makes Turner look mediocre won't happen again...And Iggy played just like he is.. An overpaid average wing on a good team..needs to be gone

TS reply to Tray on Jan 11 at 21:17

Dre is obviously still hurt. Anyone with eyes can see that.

Rich reply to TS on Jan 11 at 21:20

Yeah I didn't even see that part of his comment. I about 100 percent disagree with that post, except the Favors part.

eddies' heady's reply to Rich on Jan 11 at 21:31

What? You didn't just say those last four words after the comma did ya?

Rich reply to Tray on Jan 11 at 21:17

Turner's had two good games in a row.

How is it you don't comprehend small sample size, returning from injury, getting into game shape, or common sense?

Every god damned play is for Lou. What the fuck is going on?

eddies' heady's on Jan 11 at 21:15

Why the hell did Jrue foul that far out from the basket w/ the shot clock under ten?

Looks like Lou is gonna shoot us out of this game too.

Awful, awful, awful foul Jrue. Too late to take a foul, Collison is a good FT shooter.

That's fucking stupid, young man.

Fuck Lou.

Alvin reply to Alvin on Jan 11 at 21:19


Wow I hate that Lou is still in the game and turner who has been very good tonight is out. Doug, for some odd reason is infatuated with Lou.

Lou and Jrue are the worse 1-2 finishing combo in the NBA...

FU Lou, FU Doug.

Jim bean on Jan 11 at 21:17

Why the fuck were the last two plays by us shots by Lou? Fuck me dead

Alvin reply to Jim bean on Jan 11 at 21:21

because Lou's "one of our best players". Ugh. Fuck everything. I hate him more than I ever hated Willie. And I think that says plenty.

This is what bad teams do BTW. Give you a glimmer of hope, then screw you over once the easy part of the schedule emerges.

that was another play called for Lou. Indy just cut it off. Every fucking play. I just don't get this.

johnrosz on Jan 11 at 21:18


Good for you Lou, pad those stats.

To be fair, they had no right to be in this game with the defense they played 4/5 of the night.

Alvin reply to Rich on Jan 11 at 21:27

That's the main point there. This team cannot win games if they don't defend well. (not defending well is odd for a Doug Collins team).

They weren't gonna get the foul there no matter what. Free throw discrepancy too wide.

You ride a 20 year old PG- no matter his talent- and you will lose a lot of close games. Its just reality for the Sixers right now (not that its all his fault, but the PG is supposed to lead...)

Hopefully this leads to Jrue learning to be a good closer- but for at least this year it is pain.

As for Lou- he's just a stone cold killer.

johnrosz reply to tk76 on Jan 11 at 21:22

how is he supposed to do that when it looks like everything is meant to run through Lou within the last 5 minutes?

Lou is just a selfish, dreadful basketball player. Unbelievable.

tk76 reply to johnrosz on Jan 11 at 21:24

Jrue's the PG and the best player (at least on offense.) he needs to run the show and ensure victories.

Either he can't do it yet, Collins lacks faith in him... or some combo.

Rich reply to tk76 on Jan 11 at 21:24

I have about one million thoughts on the subject, none of them positive. How about this one:

Jrue is forced to be a spot-up three point shooter when Lou is dribbling the air out of the ball, when Jrue is clearly better off the dribble. This is actually hurting Jrue's effectiveness and stunting his growth instead of just ignoring it.

I don't get why he doesn't close games.

tk76 reply to Rich on Jan 11 at 21:26

I know why. because he is 20, and he can't do what he does when the game gets tight at the close.

The bigger question is at what point can ghe become their closer? Not necessarily getting all the points- but ensuring proper execution of high percentage offense?


What are you basing that on?

tk76 reply to Brian on Jan 11 at 21:33

Sorry, basing what on?

because he is 20, and he can't do what he does when the game gets tight at the close.

That. What are you basing that on?

tk76 reply to Brian on Jan 11 at 21:47

Gotcha. Sort of responded to this in my reply to Rich. I don't believe he's been very effective in crunch time this year. And I think its because teams double him and apply heavier pressure.

bebopdeluxe reply to tk76 on Jan 11 at 22:00

I think that he makes the kind of mistakes that I am sure that any 20-year-old would make in the NBA...and hopefully, with experience, those mistakes will lessen.

As far as being the guy to control the "flow" at the end of the game, that ALL depends on two people: 1) Doug Collins (who needs to either SIT LOU'S BONY ASS on the bench or demand that Thorn trade him for a bag o' balls) and 2) Andre Iguodala (who needs to allow Jrue to have the keys).

Turner growing a sack in the guts of the game (as opposed to swinging the ball from the wing 25 feet from the basket) will also help...but - to and extent - this
ALSO depends on two people (see above).

Rich reply to tk76 on Jan 11 at 21:33

Why can't he do what he does at the end of games? I've seen plenty of times when he does good things at the end of games. While I think his mindset is a little timid, he won't ever get rid of that if Lou is being force-fed the ball at the end of games. When he has the ball, they run their best offense.

tk76 reply to Rich on Jan 11 at 21:38

How many silly TO's and bad fouls has Jrue made late in games this year? versus how often has he settled the team down and executed crisp offense?

The only real positives I've seen out of Jrue late in games is when he scores (usually shooting over a double team.) He has not created much easy offense for his team.

Not saying this is all on Jrue vs Collins schemes. And overall the team has come up short in nearly every close game this year.

This is not bashing, its observational (at least from my subjective memory.) And I think being 20 has a ton to do with it- which suggests he can develop beyond this issue.

IMO its similar to gow some players struggle their first year or two in the playoffs. They are not ready for the increased pressure and intensity. I believe that is where Jrue is right now in late game situations.

I believe Jrue is pushed off the ball in late-game situations, and really has been the entire season. When he does get the ball, it's late in the shot clock and there is no play to be run.

I'm not saying your argument is right or wrong but he won't get better in closing minutes if Doug doesn't give him the ball in closing minutes. Again, whether you're right or wrong KEEP GIVING THE BALL TO JRUE because he's shown the ability to improve at what he's bad at. I don't want to see Lou Williams running the offense EVER only an idiot thinks that's a good idea - but he it really shouldn't happen when Jrue is on the floor

This is Jrue's team
This team will only go as far inthe future as Jrue carries them
Developing Jrue is more important than the 8 seed or playing louis williams

Again, whether your hypothesis is right or wrong (and if synergy would get their shit together we could check) is irrelevant - without continued growth of Jrue Holiday this team is NEVER going anywhere that matters (losing in the first round doesn't matter) SO GIVE HIM THE DAMN BALL

tk76 reply to GoSixers on Jan 11 at 21:49


bebopdeluxe reply to GoSixers on Jan 11 at 22:02

Well played, sir.

Rich reply to tk76 on Jan 11 at 21:46

He does make head-scratching fouls from time to time, but they mostly occur earlier in games. Silly TOs too, but I don't think there are that many late in games. I agree that mentally he's got to get a little better, but it's not showing up late in games IMO.

To me, he is too passive late in games, and that's because he's not at the controls. He's not allowed to initiate offense like he does the rest of the game. If he's still making mistake late in games when he gets the ball in his hands, great, he'll learn then. He's not getting the ball though, which makes him solely a scorer late in the clock.

He's 20 years old

He's only a couple months older than John Wall

If John Wall made silly fouls it would be 'he's young'

Jrue is Young

Jrue should be the focus of the team in crunch time if the other option is Lou - period - because it's vital to the growth of this team beyond suckitude mediocrity

Rich reply to GoSixers on Jan 11 at 22:02

Oh stop, Jrue gets the "he's young" defense more than anyone. Not saying the argument doesn't have validity (It's true), but everyone knows that he's a young player.

tk76 reply to Rich on Jan 11 at 21:54

Trying to find some objective data:

"Clutch Statistics

(4th quarter or overtime, less than 5 minutes left,
neither team ahead by more than 5 points)"

-Passing rating only 2.4 in "clutch time" vs 9.8 overall.

-Assist per bad pass 1.6 vs 3.9 overall.

-Hands rating 8.6 in clutch vs 21.3 overall.

Only 2 close and 1 dunk assist in clutch time.

he does score and hit jumpers well in "clutch time."

How old is he again?

How will he get better if they don't give him the ball?

It's like saying you want to protect his psyche so you sit him against Nate Robinson. Dude cant get better at something if you just play him out of position during that time frame.

It's an asinine development move - and you know it - but yo useem to be defending it?

tk76 reply to GoSixers on Jan 11 at 21:59

I'm not defending anything- other than my priro assertion that Jrue struggles down the stretch.

Look at my initial post. I wanted feedback on how to develop him into a closer that is more like his effectiveness at other times in the game. I agree its because he is 20- and its one of the hardest parts of the game to master.

You know what doesn't work - sticking him in the corner and letting a ball hog play his position

ANother strike against Collins

Rich reply to tk76 on Jan 11 at 22:06

I agree that he struggles down the stretch. That I do agree with. My point was basically that we aren't even making any progress if he's forced to be stuck in a corner watching Lou. Again, it's all pretty obvious.

You know, I was thinking about how many opportunities Jrue has had to close games. As in, the ball was in his hands, running the offense, down the stretch of a close game. Only one came to mind, at Denver. It's probably no coincidence that Lou wasn't with the team that night. Take a look at his production over the last five minutes.

tk76 reply to Brian on Jan 11 at 21:41

Sorry, not making much from that box score- but that was once of the few nights the Sixers closed out a reasonably tight game.

Might not just be a coincidence that the one game they close well is the game where they keep the ball in the hands of their point guard instead of giving it to a gunner who shoots less than 40% from the floor on every play.

Rich reply to Brian on Jan 11 at 21:54

Closing games on this team should be simple: We have no great isolation/facilitating wing player to give the ball to. Iguodala isn't bad, but that's not his thing when teams try to make him a scorer.

There are also no great 1 on 1 low post scorers. EB is more a pick and pop guy at this point.

The PG is the best offensive player right now. He works best within the flow of the offense. This way, he gets to do what he does comfortably, and the offense flows like it has all game if he doesn't wanna score. Maybe Thad gets a favorable matchup, maybe EB cutting, maybe a Jodie three, etc.

It all starts with Jrue initiating things though.

tk76 reply to Rich on Jan 11 at 22:03

I want to here Collins say something to this effect. This is a reasonably effective and efficient offensive team until the closing minutes of games (and OT.)

No more Lou or Iguodala isolation dowbn the stretch. Run plays and generate good looks within the flow of the offense. And if teams double team Jrue, develop counters that result in dunks.

This would all probably be moot if they had a legit P&R threat to run off of down the stretch...

If your team isn't running an offense that you can depend on in the final 5 minutes of the game - your team is running a stupid offense.

You know, I might agree with this if Jrue was actually allowed to run the point in the last five minutes. What we have right now is Jrue standing around watching like the rest of the team, and the "bad shots" he's taking because he doesn't actually touch the ball until there are 3 or 4 seconds left on the shot clock.

For the life of me, I can't figure out why they just stop running the offense and let it become the Lou show down the stretch. I guess it's great when he can't miss and/or idiots on the other team are fouling him on jumpers. The other 98/100 games, it fucking sucks.

mgfields reply to Brian on Jan 11 at 23:16

I've heard Collins say in interviews that when the defense pressure increase in the 4th quarter the team needs to simplify the offense so its easier to get a shot off.

Hence the Lou iso. Why its not the Jrue iso is beyond me.

Final: PHI 103, IND 111

And this game ends with an appropriate Lou miss. I HATE LOU.

Old School Sixer Fan on Jan 11 at 21:21

Why does everyone else run the P&R except the Sixers? Do we have the worst P&R defense in the league?

Lousy bigs. I don't think Brand is much ofa P&R threat. Just shoots jumpers. When he rolls he gets his shot blocked. And Hawes... forget about that.

Probably - and have for years

Elton Brand can't defend anyone in P and R. One of the clauses in the philly max

What a fucking fail team. Fail players with a fail coach.

eddies' heady's on Jan 11 at 21:22

We shoot almost 50%. We shoot 41% from three. We attempt 17 free throws to their 9. We really don't get killed on the boards. Blow them out on fast break points. Have 26 gives on 41 makes. Less turnovers than them and still lose by 8?

You lose when you make Dunleavy and Collison look like all-stars.

bebopdeluxe on Jan 11 at 21:22

I can understand Collins looking for combinations that will work in a game like this (when you can't stop the other team), but not in the last 6 minutes of the game. Pick your best guys and run with them.

Our substitution rotation looked very "brace-facey" tonight...no rhyme, reason or flow.

Given how the team has played over the past month, this was a BAD loss.

Please stop playing Lou Williams but if he's on the court with Jrue Holiday - Lou should never bring the ball up - EVER (or when Evan Turner is on the floor or when Andre Iguodala is on the floor)

Lou initiating your offense is asinine - there will be no initiation - just sputter sputter sputter clank

How is it so obvious to the rest of the world that LOuis wiliams isn't a point guard - but the great doug collins doesn't seem to get it.

So considering that Granger had a great night in spite of our All-World defender returning, maybe all your claims that Wright and Luol and whoever would never, ever have had big nights if Iguodala had been there look a little overstated?

Cousins had a really bad game today. First time in seven games.

So you never had to go from not playing NBA basketball for 2 weeks because of tendinitis THAT ISN"T FULLY HEALED to running full speed.

We get it - you hate Iguodala - but for a potential lawyer - you seem to ignore facts quite a lot to prove your point - are you sure you don't want to work for fox news instead?

jkay reply to GoSixers on Jan 11 at 21:40

how dare you use the F word!

Given how I've been really critical of this team despite its ocasiobnal successes you'd think losses these last 2 games would not sting so badly.

But being unsurprised by pathetic losses does not make them any less painfull. This game made me want to puke... physically ill thinking about it.

Having some respectable, close losses against top teams means zero if you fall flat against teams like the Pacers, Wizards and Pistons- when those teams come in with huge losing streaks.

I didn't make that 9:15 post. The one where "I" said we should have picked Favors. And called Iguodala overpaid and average. Someone trying to make me look dumb. Though I agree with pseudo-Tray that Favors looks like a better choice, in retrospect. Iguodala's a whole lot better than average, however.

Rich reply to Tray on Jan 11 at 21:40

Maybe it's another Tray. You might have to identify yourself with your Cousins love in future cases.

It was an amazing imitation though - spot on

Tray reply to GoSixers on Jan 12 at 1:39

Not so, I've never said that Iguodala's average or even overpaid. I think he's a good value; if our Phillymax had gone to someone deserving of one, we'd be alright with Iguodala as our 2nd best player and 3rd option, getting paid what he does.

tk76 reply to Rich on Jan 11 at 21:45

Tray "Love Cousins" and Tray "Love Favors."

As opposed to Ty Love.

what you all don;t get is that Lou is officially DC's closer. see how he was stingy with the minutes in the 1-3rd quarters but in the fourth, he sprung him out and ran every play for him.
blame Collins.
no need to kill the messenger. Lou is doing all Lou can, which is score, shoot, shoot, pump fake, shoot.

hope DC can develop some faith in the kid and let him run the show late.

If Lou is Doug Collins closer - Doug Collins lies and is an idiot and should be fired.

jkay reply to GoSixers on Jan 11 at 21:46

the fact that Lou was getting eaten up by even TJ Ford yet still had to see that much floor time,
the insistence on the 4 guard lineup in the 4th while Speights was collecting dust on the bench,
subbing Turner out for Iguodala when he saw the defense was lacking instead of pushing ET to the 2?

that's how I see it anyway.

johnrosz on Jan 11 at 21:43

of course nobody in our idiot media asks why Jrue plays off the ball in crunch time...

Please fire Doug Collins

Thank you

johnrosz reply to GoSixers on Jan 11 at 21:48

that's just foolish. you consider yourself mr. rational and then you say absurd things like that. come on man.

I suppose if I was excited about his hire - you would have a point, but I wasn't - I was very nonplussed and unimpressed with his hire. He's been unimpressive to me thus far because

A. He talks out of his ass - if defense matters - why does Lou Play?
B. There's no reason for Hawes to play over Speights, they both suck but Speights has more offensive game and isn't blown over by a light wind.
C. Lou Williams isn't a point guard - it's obvious to even someone as dumb as me - yet he's running the point WHEN JRUE HOLIDAY IS IN THE GAME
D. When things work in the first half - Doug ignores them in the second half (numerous elton brand games)
E. Nocioni sucks and plays too much

I was very unimpressed with teh hire, I'm so far unimpressed with what he thinks is the right direction to guide this team in . He's more worried about his own W-L record to me than developing the pieces that matter on this team.

johnrosz reply to GoSixers on Jan 11 at 22:09

I don't think there was a better alternative, and I think they're lucky to have him coaching this team. He's done a fantastic job with Jrue. He's spent a majority of his time undoing the disastrous work of Eddie Jordan, trying to get a young team to unlearn awful habits.

I'm sure you'll see him go to Speights in the starting lineup soon enough. He ripped Hawes in the post game, basically said he's been awful.

You have no idea if there was a better alternative, there is just a series of retreads that people drool over based on things they did decades (or more) ago. It was a dumb hire but a hire that impressed people who weren't paying attention. This team will not GROW with him as a coach - but they might keep getting their ass kicked in the first round - won't that be fun.

Rich reply to GoSixers on Jan 11 at 22:18

You don't think the team is growing? I sure do.

Really, this team only has a few young players to grow-

Jrue? Check, just give him the ball in crunch time more.

Turner? Showing life, has bought into the defensive end, and when he wasn't playing he really was hurting the team. As long as he competes like he has been, he'll play.

Iguodala plays like he should. Brand and Thad (who are playing great), ditto.

We do not have any promising young rookies stowed away on the bench that he's sitting.

bebopdeluxe reply to GoSixers on Jan 11 at 22:09

While this is one of the first games where I really think that Collins helped cost the team a game (with his nonsensical rotations), I still think that he was a good hire. Thad's game has returned. It looks like his "tough love" with Speights is starting to pay dividends. Brand is a productive NBA player. Even after a less-than-stellar game tonight, Jrue has taken a BIG leap forward in his game. I'm even OK (most nights) with him allowing Noc to be in the rotation...and he has had some quality contributions.

My biggest problems are 1) TOO MUCH FUCKING LOU WILLIAMS (can we get a 2nd round pick and an exemption for him?) and 2) not telling Turner to STOP GIVING THE BALL TO LOU (or, better yet, BENCHING LOU and giving Turner the same minutes and opportunity to grow that you so elequently said that Jrue should get in a post above.

The fact that it is either Cousins love for me or Favors love for the imitator shows there is no love for Turner. I want to elaborate that iguodala is above average only in terms of defense and anything BUT scoring. The fact that this team has no consistent threat offensively (at least 21ppg plus) will be the ongoing motif behind our mediocrity.

Really - you can't be better than mediocre unles you have a 21 PPG scorer

You know there are only 19 of them in the league right?

tk76 reply to GoSixers on Jan 11 at 22:12

Amazingly over 1/2 of them are on either mediocre or flat out lousy teams.

I didn't look at who they were - i just counted - i noticed Rudy Gay and Michael Beasley stood out.

You know - if Donald Sterling weren't an utter douche - the Clippers would have a bright future - but he ain't paying to keep those guys long term

Well, I would say teams 1-10 are better than mediocre, teams 11-20 are mediocre, and teams 21+ are worse than mediocre. If there are 19 players averaging 21+, and half are on mediocre or worse teams, it means 9 of 10 "better than mediocre" teams have one. I'm not sure how this disproves that having a 21+ ppg scorer is a (near) necessity to being better than mediocre. It proves having a 21+ ppg scorer doesn't guarantee better than mediocrity, but that wasn't the argument.

Not really disagreeing...

But of the teams with the top 10 best records, Bos, Atl and SA lack a top 20 scorer. Although JJ might be top 20 by the end of the year.

I do think you almost have to have stars to be a top 10 team. And I'm not sure any current Sixer will be a top 20 NBA player at any time in their careers. But I've already beaten that drum too much.

True, but both Boston and San Antonio have guys capable of averaging 20 ppg. Having enough talent that it dilutes your usage isn't really an indictment on not having a capable scorer, IMO.

Tray reply to GoSixers on Jan 11 at 22:15

Thus proving my point because those 19 players are all on more successful teams than the sixers.

They are are they? The clippers have TWO of them - TWO of them - more than 10% (holy crap) of the 21 PPG scorers are on the clippers...going into today's game they lost 2/3 of all the games they played.

THe Raptors are better than the sixers?

The Warriors aren't any better or worse than the sixers

The T'Wolves are god awful

This has to be fake tray - real tray isn't this stupid

(25% of these guys are on the raptors, wolves, and clippers, holy crap)

tk76 reply to Tray on Jan 11 at 22:21

Griffin, Gordon, Bargs, Beasley, Love, Granger, Gay, Martin and Ellis won't be sniffing the playoffs this year. And that's nearly 1/2 of the top 20 scorers.

Kevjumba on Jan 11 at 22:05

I concur with firing DC and hiring Larry Brown.. He's got a better team than he did in 2001 and he can make something of it with his magical skills...(except alot if other teams got even better a la Miami Cheat)

Put down the crack and the booze.

I'd rather have Eddie Jordan coach this team again than the rat.

Larry Brown is a complete and utter ass - and the fact that he keeps getting hired after his last 3 jobs is pathetic

johnrosz reply to GoSixers on Jan 11 at 22:10

he's a great basketball mind, can't deny that. Not in love with the way he tries to control the front office though.

He was a great basketball mind.

The game has changed, he hasn't, and look how the bobcats burnt out on him in less than two years.

Are there any other UNC folk left in the NBA willing to hire this carpetbagging megalomaniac douche bag.

A GREAT basketball mind knows how to adjust to the folks on your roster - Brown never adjusts - brown just whines when it doesn't work like he wants it to and then blames the players

johnrosz reply to GoSixers on Jan 11 at 22:18

he had his team in the finals 5 years ago. has the league really changed that much since then?

Oh you mean the job that he had no input in putting together, sabotaged his way out of looking for a job DURING THE PLAYOFFS and whined about it so much too?

Larry Brown is incapable of adjusting to anything - he was handed a gift by Joe DUmars

johnrosz reply to GoSixers on Jan 11 at 22:40

you think that team was really so special? A title was gift wrapped? I don't...they were probably the one outlier in the last 2 decades of dominant Finals teams. They beat a Laker team looking for its 4th title of the decade, after beating the previous years champions in the 2nd round

Yes the title was a gift to Brown- one he tried to dismantle almost immediately but he worked for a GM who basically said kiss my ass so he started looking for a job DURING THE PLAYOFSS WHEN HIS TEAM WAS STILL IN THEM

2011 was 10 years ago folks - stop living in the past - stop thinking Brown is coming back and stop thinking Larry Brown is a good coach to bring in to a franchise that needs to GROWN AND DEVELOP - Larry Brown ONLY CARES ABOUT LARRY BROWN

Brown IS a great basketball mind. Having won a championship in 2004, making the finals in 2005, and getting charlotte (which won 32 games the year before he took over) to 44 wins and a playoff birth is a decent track record to show he's still got something on the current game of basketball.

Do I want him? No. I don't want him making personnel moves. But to deny that he's still a great basketball mind and an effective coach because Michael Jordan's tinkering and front office failures led to a disappointing 28 games this year is just flat out wrong. I get that you don't like the man, and I understand why, but you're letting it get in the way of rational analysis.

He lost his entire team - they enjoy it now that he's gone - he's rubs on people rawer and faster than i do - he can't get jobs except from his UNC cronies any more - he's a douchebag whose net impact on a franchise is negative because of his inability to coach beyond his square.

Yes I hate him - but if I felt he'd be a good coach for this roster - I'd want him back - but he's not.

He's not a good coach for any roster because his ego and obstinacy gets in the way of actual coaching and teaching.

Hopefully he will now slink off into the sunset instead of desperately chasing another job and running himself out of town now that all GM's are on to him and his insanity

johnrosz reply to GoSixers on Jan 11 at 22:45

You're the douchebag, if you actually saw the situation in Charlotte you would see that his players lacked enthusiasm and played shit. They got demoralized when Felton left and became good in the Knicks... Could you blame LB for whining? He has no input on Felton leaving, front office just let him walk.

If he can't adjust how did he go from a team with only 1 star and make finals (sixers) then go onto the pistons (totally different team) and win the finals?

Game. Set. Match

Oh you think that Larry Brown wanted the Bobcats to keep Raymond Felton?


johnrosz reply to GoSixers on Jan 11 at 22:57

Brown admitted the decision to let Felton leave and sign a two-year, $16 million free agent contract with the Knicks was "financial," as the Bobcats didn’t want to re-sign him and pay the luxury tax.

"He’s great," Brown said. "I think what he brought to our team was something you can’t replace. He plays hard every day, plays hurt, practices hard."


Brown publicly stating something thta clears him of any blame and responsibility?

Pardon me if I don't necessarily believe that's what happened.

Brown is the king of blaming other people :)

bebopdeluxe reply to GoSixers on Jan 12 at 10:21

What evidence do you have to prove that Brown did NOT want Felton re-signed...and is simply using the salary cap/luxury tax excuse to cover a stupid personnel decision that he made?

You hatred of "the rat" (aka LB) is well known (both here and at RealGM and probably everywhere else you post). While I have pushed for bringing him back from time to time, I can't imagine that I would have pushed for bringing him back over Collins - I think that DC brings many of the same qualities that I like in LB (stressing "playing the right way"...emphasizing fundamentals, helping young players develop their games), with perhaps a little less drama.

I would certainly agree with you that Collins' insistence in playing Lou goes against everything that he has said about "earning" playing time, and that is frustrating. I would also like to see a bit less of a focus on making the playoffs and more of a focus on developing our young assets (especially Jrue and Turner). However, the re-emergence of Thad's game and even Speights' recent return to relevence are probably both a function of what Collins is teaching/selling, and I am happy with those developments.

While I was certainly frustrated with last night's game - and what I thought was a crappy job or coaching by Collins - I still think that he has had a positive impact on the team.

History is a great indicator of present and future performance (all your ranting and raving towards certain players you hate guarantee you'll do it again and again in the future)

Browns history is to look for blame everywhere but in the mirror - be it Philly, or how he 'left' in Detroit, or how he done messed up the Olympics horribly. It's NEVER Larry Browns fault, so you'll pardon me if I don't believe the narcissistic megalomaniac when he says that Raymond Felton was purely a financial decision - which conveniently means he has no complicity in the decision to let him go when his mercurial love hate of players probably had him wanting rid of felton 6 or 7 times during the season last year.

If people here want to believe that what people say in the media is the gods honest truth - go right ahead - history seems to indicate most times what people say publicly isn't so much the truth but what they want the public to believe, be it athletes, politicians, or preachers. Look at the history of the persons actions and then decide if you're going to believe them or not. Browns history is more telling than one comment.

johnrosz reply to GoSixers on Jan 11 at 23:08

for the record, someones using my name. you're not arguing with me, haven't been for the last 2 or 3 posts, i didn't call you a douchebag

tk76 reply to johnrosz on Jan 11 at 22:17

I'm a fan of Collins- even if I don't agree with all of his decisions.

If his benching of Turner and Speights successful lights a fire and he gives them a chance to earn their minutes back- then it is quality coaching and a good forest/trees move. But if he is just playing guys like Nocioni or Battie to steal some wins- then it bad coaching. I'm hoping its nore the former.

I sort of see Collins as like a more normal LB, without the melodrama and a little less tear your hair out boring offense.

Care to explain where Louis Williams fits into the 'lighting a fire' thing under anyone?

His whole 'play defense or don't play' is BS - Turner may suck offensively - but he's better defensively than lou

johnrosz on Jan 11 at 23:05

hey brian, someones using my name to call people douchebags. did it to Tray too. what's the deal

I think it's taken care of.

I know it got a little overshadowed by the rest of the game, but Turner played well again tonight. I thought he really picked up the team in the 2nd quarter. I'll keep saying it, but his change of direction moves are going to get better and better as we go along. As long as he's aggressive and getting those close in looks, he's going to be a tough cover.

That's 2 good games in a row now, let's see if he can string a third together.

Heh, I'd like to take this opportunity to behold DeMarcus Cousins' stellar night. 4/19 from the floor, 2/6 from the line, 3 turnovers, 4 personal fouls, 10 points.

Mike P reply to Brian on Jan 12 at 1:23

If only you had enough bandwidth to post every time Turner had a bad night.


The one huge knock I have on Doug Collins right now is his lack of faith in our two young corner stones. Turner should be getting 30 minutes a night, minimum. Why would the owners let Collins jerk around his playing time like it's has been.

Even if we make the playoffs, Miami is just going to blast our asses. The most frustrating thing about the Sixers since AI was here is the lack of the owners/front office to say "Our team is bad, we have to rebuild"

Even after getting Turner and the team going nowhere, it seems like Collins just wants to win games by any means. Why sacrifice Turners development to win 2 or 3 meaningless games?

Iguodala is a talented player, but if his play is stunting the growth of Jrue, he should be dealt. Why not try to get Beaubous from Dallas? Get Caron, Beaubous and a pick or two.

Other then Turner not lighting the world on fire, even worse is that we didn't trade Lou to get a second rounder to take DeAndre Jordan. AFTER trading Sammie.

Oh our Front Office, not giving a damn.

Mike P reply to Mike P on Jan 12 at 1:25

For whatever reason, I thought DeAndre Jordan was a rookie. Shows how much I know.

Still could have traded Lou though.

Iguodala is a talented player, but if his play is stunting the growth of Jrue, he should be dealt.

How is his play stunting Jrue's growth? Jrue's last two games w/ Iguodala:

- 15/26 from the floor
- 4/8 from three
- 7/10 from the line
- 9 boards
- 11 assists
- 3 turnovers
- 41 points

Is it fair to use a sample size of only 2 games, when the entire data set of 26 game averages says he only averages 13.5 points and 5.8 assists on 42% from the field?

I mean, I'm not arguing those numbers prove anything. You're the one who used averages as proof Iguodala's not holding Jrue back. But, if you are using his numbers with Iguodala, I think the full 26 games played is more statistically relevant than just the last 2.

The implied argument here is "See what Jrue did while Iguodala was out." My point is that Jrue started this run before Iguodala was out, and continued it upon his return.

Mike P reply to Brian on Jan 12 at 11:51

As long as Iggy can figure out in his basketball brain that we need him to just be Team USA Iggy, then Jrue can be keep growing.

But if he keeps trying to do his crappy Dennis Johnson impersonation, then he needs to have a talk with Doug Collins.

As usual it is all Iguodalas fault.

I heard he was holding back Turner, but now he's holding back Jrue as well.

RUnning Lou Williams at point while Jrue is on the floor has nothing to do with it - it's Iguodalas fault

Mike P reply to GoSixers on Jan 12 at 14:37

Yes. Yes to everything you say.

Tray reply to Brian on Jan 12 at 1:50

Just for old times sake, Lawson had 16, 6 and 5 on 5 shots tonight. In 24 minutes. He did foul out, though. I guess soon enough we'll see how Lawson as starting point guard turns out. As to Jrue and his much-vaunted defense, it should be noted that tonight was Collison's first game all year with more than seven assists, and only his third 20-point game of the season.

You forgot to mention the four turnovers. When Jrue has too many turnovers, it negates any other positives in your eyes. Why the double standard?

johnrosz on Jan 11 at 23:40

Turner looks much more comfortable out there, he's been getting to the line a little bit more lately which I like. Not in love with that line drive 3 point shot, but at least he's not being hesitant anymore. Seems like he's getting shots that he feels comfortable taking. In the past it looked like his defender was forcing him into extremely difficult shots.

Little bit more success taking his man off the dribble as well.

Video: Brand after 111-103 home loss to the Pacers:


Iguodala struggles in return to Sixers' lineup:


Bravo pour votre site, le contenu est vraiment pro . Je reviendrai sur votre blog!

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