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Sixers Open Out West

6 games on espn this year, only 1 last year

all the games on espn are home games

Great, can see how empty the stadium will be

6/66 that's 9% of our games!

That's what I call respect

The Sixers don't play Boston until 3/7, and have 4 games against them in a little over a month.

Happy 40th to me

That's really an advantage. Boston should be a mess late in the season w/ all their old fuckers.

January is amazingly easy...barely any road games and a lot of cupcakes. We need to build a nice base here of momentum. Hate ending the season on a 5 game road trip, but besides that, I really like what I see. Just need to take care of January. A bit scary considering the history of slow starts, but hopefully this team has enough continuity to overcome this.

They could really have a nice cushion heading into Feb. 7-3 is conservative if they have their shit together early, could be 8-2.

It looks pretty good to me too. I certainly expected worse..

And 6 games on ESPN is a major surprise. Maybe finally the Sixers will start getting some attention.

I don't think TNT games have been announced yet, but could be wrong. As for a 7-3 start, I see 2-3 on our road trip so I'm thinking more of a 6-4 start, BUT by the end of January we should be looking very good.

Well it's tough to say based on trades and everything, but they should handle Golden State Utah and New Orleans

At Utah is a tough game. I'd say @Phoenix is more winnable.

Who is utahs guard combos again?

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Stan reply to GoSixers on Dec 6 at 19:52
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What we really need to worry about is their post presence- Al Jefferson

I'm not even joking. That guy abused us last year.

We split with them. Jefferson scored 49 points on about 53 possessions in the two games, combined, which is pretty much what you expect from that stiff.

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Stan reply to Brian on Dec 6 at 20:00
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But in the 4th quarter it felt like we couldn't stop him

Not talking about players specifically but as a place to play (Salt Lake and all).

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Rich reply to GoSixers on Dec 6 at 19:56
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Devin Harris-Raja Bell-CJ Miles-Gordon Hayward.

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Stuart reply to Rich on Dec 6 at 20:17
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and alec burks

I wonder if the 6 ESPN home games is a 'benefit' of new ownership.

The Pistons on ESPN much this year - they have new owners too right?

they have 1 vs the bucks

Pistons vs. Bucks is a national game?

yes according to the pistons website, hopefully it gets changed cause i have no idea who would want to watch that

Could of been worse, and that's what was expected. I won't expect too much to start because of the road trip, but anything under.500 in the first 10 would be embarrassing.

Could of been worse, and that's what was expected. I won't expect too much to start because of the road trip, but anything under.500 in the first 10 would be embarrassing.

Season opener at 10pm. I'm definitely staying past my bed time for that.

After the first five games on the road (thanks Disney on Ice), 18 out of the next 22 are at home. Yikes.

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Stan reply to John S on Dec 6 at 20:02
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Those 5 days of Disney on Ice will bring more money than every Sixers game for the next 5 years.

OK, so I'll add this to the post above, but here's a closer look.

2 back-to-back-to-backs, HHA, and AHA. The first one is part of a stretch of 5 games in six nights. Four of the games are at home.

16 back-to-backs (not including the b2b2b's)

- 7 home/away
- 5 away/away
- 3 away/home
- 1 home/home

The home/away is where the games are played. It's my personal opinion that an away/home back-to-back is an extreme disadvantage on the schedule, so this actually breaks down pretty well for the Sixers.

OK, here's Boston's breakdown, for a comparison.

1 back-to-back-to-back, all three away games. One five games/six nights (four of the games on the road).

17 back-to-backs (not including the b2b2b)

- 5 home/away
- 5 away/away
- 7 away/home

The Celts only have one b2b2b, but overall I think the Celts have a more challenging schedule of the short/no rest games due to the 4 away games in the 5/6nights and 7 away/home b2b's. That's really bad. Basically forget about the home court advantage for over 10% of their home games.

No TNT games for us. D Aldrdge has schedule link up on twitter.

And it looks like they probably aren't on TNT, only one Thursday night game, the last game of the year against the Pistons.

Any ABC games :)

What would the time be? Sunday afternoon. The answer is probably no.

Love all the people saying how we should handle all these opening games on the road. Have you watched this team before? We should all know by now how tough west coast trips can be, especially in the beginning of a season with an abbreviated camp where no one knows what half the rosters even look like. And we should all know this team has a knack for losing games it shouldn't (and to be fair, vice versa). We might look at the Warriors game and chalk that up as W but that is always a tough place to play no matter how bad they are. And that goes for the Celtics or Heat, let alone a Sixers team that was .500 last season. We'd be lucky to make it back from any 6-game road trip 3-3 imo.

First, everybody has as short preseason so teams with continuity will have an advantage. Usually these West coast trips happen in the middle of the year - in this case there will be no fatigue, in fact, I like getting this out of the way early before the grind kicks in.

I'll say 3-2 on the trip, with a win in the home opener to start 4-2.

I missed today's discussion of the rumored LA trades, but I assume we all agree that LA can't get both? Unless Smith is really nuts and thinks rebuilding around Gasol is a bright idea. They should both go to the Clippers : ) And seriously, I don't understand how Kobe will play together with Chris Paul. Paul's an extremely ball-dominant guard.

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Stan reply to Tray on Dec 6 at 23:25
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They could find another that will trade young prospects for Gasol

It would be awesome if multiple teams put their heads together and figured out how to create another juggernaut in the purple and gold.

Portland: L
Phx: W
Uta: L
GS: W
NOH: L
Det: W
Tor: W
Indy: L
Sac: W
NYK: L

first 10 we go 5-5 is my prediction, and i don't think that would be indicative of not having their act together. the only bad loss i see in that list would be utah.

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Mike reply to Mike on Dec 6 at 21:22
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assuming chris paul isn't traded for garbage

I'd consider Indy a bad loss at this point as well, depending on what they do.

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Mike reply to Brian on Dec 6 at 21:30
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toss up, they looked pretty damn good against the bulls so i gave them the edge early on

I consider a loss to the NOH even with out trading Chris Paul a bad loss personally

And the whole 'this team is getting better' thing means they shouldn't start crapola and they should be better on the road - you know the advantages of continuity & all

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Mike reply to GoSixers on Dec 6 at 21:48
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in New Orleans to a team that took LA to 6? a game on the road against a playoff team in the West is usually a loss unless you're one of the best teams in the East.

Hmmm...a team that currently only has SEVEN players under contract, and either complete upheaval or constant questions about when Chris Paul is going to be traded?

I'm not really sure what losing in the first round last year means, but you seem to put a whole lot of stock in it, shouldn't the sixers get some credit than for the fact that the heat went much farther than the lakers last year?

i don't know maybe my expectations for this team are different. they are still not close to competing for anything meaningful imo.

I'm not sure I said they'd compete for anything meaningful - they'll most likely be 500 and lose in the first round to the 1 or 2 seed (Chicago, Miami)

Doesn't mean they shouldn't go 3-2 to open their season - early in the season their 'continuity' probably will help a little, especially against a poorly rostered team like the hornets who will be a mess

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Tom Moore on Dec 6 at 22:25
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Story: Sixers open season with difficult stretch, including five in a row on the road:

http://t.co/RTBQ2Oiq

I'm already pumped for the 26th. They always are really competitive against Portland, and I expect this one to be no different. They lost to them last year, as Wes Matthews killed them early and Gerald Wallace got them the rest of the way. They played that game without Iguodala, and were still in it at points coming off playing in Sacramento the night before. Should be fun.

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Sharone Wright on Dec 6 at 23:01
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Anybody hear Aron say Igodala is overrated on Sonny Hill's show? Who is this guy to tell us that after the putrid playoffs Iggy had?

I'm going to guess that you mean underrated. Or you're just an idiot. Or both. Probably both.

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Sharone Wright reply to Brian on Dec 7 at 8:43
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Sorry yeah, I meant underrated.

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Sharone Wright reply to Brian on Dec 7 at 8:59
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Kind of a disproportionately caustic response to a typo. Suddenly an Adam Aron fan?

This schedule is kind of crazy. They play Miami 4 times, 2 h/2 a. But they only play Boston 3 times.

Added some more stuff to the post above. 33 games vs. playoff teams last season (18 at home). 33 games vs. non-playoff teams last year (15 at home).

Anyone think they won more total games this season then last- meaning more than41wins ?

42-24. That's a stretch if they don't make a big roster change. What's a realistic goal?

41 wins in a normal season = 33 wins this season.
45 wins in a normal season = 36 wins this season.
50 wins in a normal season = 40 wins this season.
55 wins in a normal season = 44 wins this season.
60 wins in a normal season = 48 wins this season.

So you'd have to consider anything better than 36 wins an improvement. 40 wins would be a pretty big jump.

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Rich reply to Brian on Dec 7 at 0:51
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36-40 would be a nice improvement, anywhere in there.

Love this schedule from a basketball fan's perspective. So many games. Especially great in January and February they play literally every Friday and Saturday night. That is something to look forward to every week while grinding away at work.

Per Sam Amick, Dubs are offering Curry, Udoh and Klay Thompson for CP3. That's one the Hornets have to take a hard look at.

Gordon + the Minny pick probably trumps that for me. Udoh and Thompson aren't worth as much as the Minny pick. Of course, you have to extend Gordon sooner, but I like Curry more. Close call.

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Rich reply to Brian on Dec 7 at 1:34
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Are the Clips offering that officially? I'd probably take that too because the Minny pick is Top 10. Then again, when you lose CP3, the Hornets could be picking pretty high in the draft as well. They get potentially two very solid rotational guys, plus Curry, plus a possible top pick in this draft.

Then again, if they just got Gordon, they would probably be picking twice in the Top 10 this season. That is a tough one.

Gordon plus two high lottery picks is a pretty nice reset button. That's the package I'd take if they really have a choice between the two. Both of those offers blow the Lakers out of the water unless NOH has a hard on for Bynum and ignores the injuries.

Apparently the Clippers are offering Kaman, Bledsoe, Aminu and the Minny pick. I'd take a known commodity in Steph Curry over this but it's not a bad deal at all. In the end the Hornets will have a done a good job trading Paul early instead of waiting for him to leave without compensation.

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Rich reply to Xsago on Dec 7 at 1:54
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They might be able to leverage the Clips into giving up Gordon now, with the leverage that Golden State offer brings. That blows any deal with Kaman in it out of the water.

Kaman is in there for salary purposes i presume.

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Rich reply to Xsago on Dec 7 at 2:05
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Yes he would be, I was unclear in what I meant on that. It's a worse deal in that you are getting two pretty promising young rotational guys in both deals depending on how much you like those four players, but you are replacing Curry with Kaman, a basic salary dump. Those deals are really no contest.

If that's the Clips best offer, I take the GSW deal without blinking. That package from the Clips is the Minny pick and garbage in terms of rebuilding a team. Curry is a step down from Paul, to be sure, but he's not a giant leap down. He was outstanding last year.

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Tray reply to Brian on Dec 7 at 3:18
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I think he's a pretty large leap down. MVP-caliber player vs., I don't know, a top 25 player who's crap defensively? It would really depend on how much you like this draft and how much you like Aminu; I imagine some teams are high on him. That aside, in what world does Paul extend with GSW? So he can play with Monta, Dorrell Wright and an overpaid David Lee? I don't think that team would ever even make a conference finals, and they wouldn't have much cap room after they did give Paul a big deal. I suppose they could then attempt to pawn Monta off on someone. Someone like us, for example, but Iguodala wouldn't turn them into a contender either. Then there's the Rudy Gay rumor. Don't know if that's even an upgrade but either way it doesn't get them very far.

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Tray reply to Tray on Dec 7 at 3:23
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Also, the Clippers are reportedly offering Jordan, which makes their deal a lot more attractive; on the other hand, GSW supposedly has a nice shot at Chandler. I suppose Paul/Chandler/Ellis (or Gay or Iguodala) is the makings of an alright team... but if I were him I'd attempt to force my way to the Clippers. The other possibility, apparently, is a trade to Boston for Rondo, picks and Jeff Green. Not a Jeff Green fan at all but I think Rondo's about as good a get as Curry. The theory here is that Paul would attempt to win a title with the big three, and then, when they come off the books, try to attract Howard to come play with him.

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Rich reply to Tray on Dec 7 at 17:53
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Chris Paul was a Janero Pargo irrational confidence outburst away from a conference finals. I think that team would certainly be in the hunt, especially if they swapped Ellis for Iguodala. He's done almost that with a worse Hornets team.

As far as it being a step down from Curry, nobody really talks about Chris Paul's knee, but that should be a concern. Maybe it was a two-year recovery, but he wasn't completely healthy last year.

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Rich reply to Rich on Dec 7 at 17:55
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*Step down to Curry, obviously. Exams starting to get the better of me.

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Tray reply to Rich on Dec 7 at 18:04
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This was the year when he was playing with Chandler, a very good (20.6 and 9) David West and a healthy Peja, hitting threes at 44% and scoring 16 a game. I guess I'd say that West >>> Lee, and Peja, with a .581 TS% >>> Monta. And, that team had the 7th best defense in the league that year, something which I can't see happening in Golden State.

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Rich reply to Brian on Dec 7 at 1:52
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Plus New Orleans might have it in their best interests to have a few ping pong balls bounce their way, if anyone believes in that sort of thing.

I will laugh so hard if Adelman pulls a "Doug Collins" and makes that Minny pick mediocre.

That's a heavy crate for what could be a 66 game rental. CP3 better not suck...

Sixers went 38-28 in the final 66 of last season...I think the goal should be 38.

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The Greek on Dec 7 at 9:55
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Details on the new Amnesty

• Teams will not be able to use the amnesty provision on a player acquired in a trade going forward….

• Teams will not be able to use the new “stretch” provision on players they acquire via the amnesty process… Teams can use the provision only on “new” contracts, or deals that don’t yet exist….

• Finally: If a team bids on a player in the amnesty waiver process, it is bidding on the full length of his contract, not just the first season.


http://probasketballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/12/06/limits-on-amnesty-leaked-including-seven-day-window/

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The Greek reply to The Greek on Dec 7 at 10:00
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Brian can you please explain to me what the stretch provision is?

Yeah, it's pretty much a get out of jail sort of free card for contracts signed from this point on.

Basically, at any time, teams can cut one player and spread out the remaining amount on his contract over multiple years. It's two times the amount of years left on the deal, plus one.

So if someone is owed $20M over 2 years, and they use the stretch on him, then instead of counting as $10M against their cap for 2 years, he would count as $4M against the cap for 5 years.

They still have to pay him, though I'm not sure if his pay gets spread out the same way, or if it's just the amount he counts against the cap that gets stretched out.

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The Greek reply to Brian on Dec 7 at 10:33
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Thanks for the explanation. Let's hope that we never have to use it. SO the amnesty can only be used over a 7 day period I'm assuming at the start of free agency every season, very interesting.

The way the article originally linked to indicates it the 7 days might only be this year, but there is a limited period in which players can be waived and then it's done for a year, which kind of makes sense because of the bidding process.

If it were me, just so it doesn't complicate free agency too much, I'd actually make the waiver process between the end of the finals and the beginning of free agency so that by the time free agency starts all players have cleared waivers or been picked up in auction so they have the 'full time' of free agency to find a team.

That's the way i initially understood it will be actually. The 7 day period will happen the week before free agency begins. You won't be able to know whether you will be able to sign the targeted player before making the amnesty decision. Has that changed?

Well if you read the original article linked to it talks about 7 days this year, and it can't happen '7 days' before free agency cause, well, free agency is only two weeks. I think the 'amnesty rules' this year might not be the same as next year, though I agree that it should be completed by the start of free agency it's really a two deadline process

1. Deadline to waive your players
2. Lists of waived players made available to teams
3. Teams submit silent bids on players they desire.

While one week is this year, I think they'll have more time after this season to complete the entire process so it is done by the time free agency starts, to allow both teams and players to move forward.

I don't know how much time is usually between the draft and free agency but I'd have the deadlines in there, people make their draft night trades and then you can do the waiver/auction process before free agency starts?

I'm probably going to read (and try to understand) the new cba when it's done :)

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The Greek reply to GoSixers on Dec 7 at 11:15
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agreed on that timing

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Stan reply to The Greek on Dec 7 at 10:58
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"Finally: If a team bids on a player in the amnesty waiver process, it is bidding on the full length of his contract, not just the first season."

You would still bid based on a percentage, right? Someone can bid on 10% of Lewis' salary and only pay him 4 million for the next two years, right?

Sounds right to me, I always assumed it was not just one year, but obviously it needs to be spelled out.

I can't believe Portland won't waive Brandon Roy

Well it's not like the Blazers will be players in free agency if they amnesty him. Paul Allen can afford to pay extra luxury tax money to try and give Roy a chance, so why not do it. Amnestying him would be a strictly financial decision this season. Who knows maybe he still has something left. And if he is indeed done for good, they can always amnesty him next year.

Just because one can afford something doesn't mean one should pay it if the projected return isn't worth it. Brandon Roy played 47 games last year, barely above 50%. He has a degenerative (confirmed) knee condition that won't get better, just worse. What's the POINT in paying him when maybe you wavie him and someone takes a flyer on him as a 'rotation guy who can't play back to back games'. Not only is portland not waiving him, they're calling him the starter.

Portland needs to turn the page on the whole 'oh god we're going to contend with brandon roy and greg oden' thing and start over -

ESPN (Bucher) reporting that the Chris Paul deal to either Golden State or the Clippers is held up by the fact that Paul won't agree to an extension, neither deal gets done with out one.

If I'm Chris Paul and want to put myself in the best position, I agree to sign with the Clippers because they have Griffin, they're in LA, and they could still get Howard. The Warriors wouldn't be able to obtain Howard

CP3, Monta, Dorrell Wright, Lee and Chandler. Probably not winning you a title, and it'd be funny to see Monta fuming about CP3 handling the ball all the time, but that's a better squad than CP3 ever had in NOH. though he would have to deal with an idiot coach.

How dare you call Marc Jackson an idiot, he's a players coach man, he played the game, HE WAS ON TV, demonstrating his expertise in the moment every week...he'll get monta to play defense.

Serously, if you're CP3 why would you want to play with monta ellis...wouldn't you rather throw oops to Griffin?

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Tray reply to Brian on Dec 7 at 18:06
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Like I said above, I think Paul, West, Chandler and Peja, who was still good a few years ago, was a better group than Paul, Ellis, Wright, Chandler and Lee would be.

Not wanting to resign with the Warriors i can understand. But the Clippers probably offer a better chance to win a championship (in theory) than the Lakers or Knicks long term. He should accept that if he is smart.

Well, the clippers offer a better chance IF sterling starts acting like an owner. Sterlings reputation is horrible around the league, not to mention his whole issue with being a giant racist bastard.

I think if the clippers re-sign Jordan then Chris Paul and Dwight will 'talk' (cause it's legal for gods sake, awful but it is) and if Dwight gives Paul the 'nod' then Paul will agree to go to LA

I think what the Clippers do with DeAndre Jordan will influence whether Paul would consider going to LA

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Stan reply to GoSixers on Dec 7 at 10:59
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I wonder what LAC is offering- Beldsoe, DeAndre, Aminu?

Bucher only confirmed one name from each team

GSW - Curry
NOH - Gordon

WHich makes sense as a starting point

If i'm NOH i also want that timberwolves pick

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Stan reply to GoSixers on Dec 7 at 11:15
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I don't think Chris Paul + Blake Griffin is good enough to beat Dallas or LAL.

Lebron James, Dwyane Wade and Chris Bosh wasn't good enough to beat Dallas

But you think Chris Paul and Blake Griffin would be?

Sorry - I misread that the first time, still waking up.

I agree with you that they wouldn't be able to beat Dallas and LAL right now, but like brian said, both teams are aging, and Paul/Griffin is a pretty good core to build around (and better than any core you'd have in GSW in my mind)

Plus the clippers, if they were to start CARING about winning, are a much more attractive free agent destination to, say, Dwight Howard, than oakland

DAL and LAL are kind of old, no?

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Stan reply to Brian on Dec 7 at 11:18
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good point.

True, the 'new powers' in the west haven't really been defined yet, if the clippers made a play for paul and somehow got howard, they would be the ascendant power in the west.

The Lakers are desperate for Paul and Howard cause they know they are old, and in LA it's about winning...

As for Dallas, I must admit, it's kind of weird they're so quiet, cause Cuban has to know dirk and his roster of castoffs don't have a long future?

Wasn't Dallas's plan to save cap flexibility and make a run at a free agent next summer (preferably Deron Williams who is from Dallas)? That's why they are not even trying to resign Chandler to this point...

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Stan reply to Xsago on Dec 7 at 11:34
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Interesting. I never saw in that POV. I always assumed Dallas would be significantly over the cap for the next 5 years. I guess this means that they'll keep Brendan Heywood and use the amnesty clause on Shawn Marion.

I wasn't aware of that, but seems kind of word to waste a year of Dirk Nowitzki, and to let a key piece of your championship roster go who isn't 'done'.

Plus you're gambling on these guys hitting the market which might not happen with any of them

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Stan reply to GoSixers on Dec 7 at 11:47
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It doesn't seem like Dirk's skill set will decline soon. He doesn't really rely on athleticism.

Even without Chandler they will should win 55-60 games. It's worth the risk. Not being able to compete for one year may be worth it if you can bring in an all star PG that will be in his prime for the next 5+ years.

But I don't think Williams or Paul or Howard hit the market - teams then lose them for nothing usually.

I think all 3 will be traded this season

No, but Paul+Griffin + a decent center in Jordan + cap space to get another star or fill out the roster properly (not like Miami) possibly can.

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Stan reply to Xsago on Dec 7 at 11:23
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I assumed NOH would get DeAndre. sign and trade? But they still have a ton of cap space.

And then Dwight Howard comes to the clippers in free agency

Then they'd be pretty good right?:)

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Stan reply to GoSixers on Dec 7 at 11:31
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It's better them than having another Lakers dynasty or douchebagness of NY to get worse.

Bucher is reporting that Howard has made it clear (through sources) that he would not sign an extension with the clippers - though not sure if getting CP3 would change that idea

"That mutual understanding is one reason why the Clippers have aggressively looked to re-sign restricted free agent center DeAndre Jordan, who is eager to remain with the Clippers, a source close to Jordan said. With the Clippers committed to building around power forward Blake Griffin, acquiring Howard simply isn't realistic, a league source said. Even if they could land Howard without including shooting guard Eric Gordon in the deal, they would then almost certainly have to incur the luxury tax to re-sign Gordon, who will be eligible for an extension of his rookie contract next summer. Paying a luxury tax for going too far over the salary cap would be a first for Clippers owner Donald Sterling. Howard does not see himself as a championship-caliber fit right now next to Griffin, sources familiar with both Howard's objectives said. Neither Howard nor Griffin can step away from the basket and score, which makes it a difficult proposition to invest so heavily in them as a combination. Both also struggle at the free-throw line. Howard is a career 59.8 percent free-throw shooter and Griffin shot 64.2 percent as a rookie last season. The expectation is that Griffin will eventually develop a mid-range jumper, but Howard's timeline for pursuing a championship is more immediate, sources said."

Remember this: CP3 will not be signing an extension this season, period. Even if he were traded to the New York Knicks, his reportedly favored team, he'd become a free agent in July 2012 and sign a new contract. He's still on that path, the only one that makes sense financially. Like Deron Williams with the New Jersey Nets, CP3 has nothing to gain from extending his deal now.

If you're the Warriors, what assurances do you need that CP3 will re-sign with you if you're giving up Curry, Udoh and Thompson? What assurances can you get? What if CP3 remains vague about his intentions, even after Golden State signs Chandler in free agency? That's a pretty lovely team -- Paul and Monta Ellis in the backcourt, Dorell Wright and Reggie Williams in the wing rotation, David Lee and Chandler up front -- but is it a major contender from Day 1? Is it good enough that CP3 won't be able to bear to leave?

The Warriors have one playoff berth in the last 17 years. The Clippers have two in the past 18. These are not teams that ought to be getting picky about how they acquire top-flight superstars. But trading huge buckets of rising talent for a player who could become a one-year rental could end up just another flub, and it's something that has to be considered incredibly carefully. On paper, just about any deal either team could make (excluding Blake Griffin) for CP3 would make sense. But look beyond this season to free agency, and it's a pretty incredible dice roll. This could be a move to make fans forget all about the failure, or it could be a nice punctuation mark on the franchises' dark eras. And there's really no telling -- unless you're inside CP3's mind -- which way it will go.

http://www.sbnation.com/2011-nba-free-agency/2011/12/7/2617630/chris-paul-trade-rumors-golden-state-warriors-los-angeles-clippers-hook

um signing an extension makes sense financially because he can make more money

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Jakey reply to GoSixers on Dec 7 at 12:23
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johnhollinger John Hollinger
What I don't get: Why Chris Paul would sign an extension anywhere. As with Deron Williams, cap rules strongly favor becoming free agent.
20 minutes ago

---------------------------------------------------

i don't know the new CBA rules, but it looks as it would benefit CP3 to become a free agent...

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Stan reply to Jakey on Dec 7 at 12:28
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If he wants to sign with NY, the most I think he can sign for is around 14 million a year. If he can get traded to NY he can sign an extension that will bring him more money.

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=3510042

Reminds me of when the Angels traded for Mark Teixeira. It's a risk that could be a one year rental...

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Stan reply to Jakey on Dec 7 at 12:18
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Sometimes it's worth the risk. I would trade everyone on our roster except Jrue for a one year rental of Howard.

Not if it's a guarantee he doesn't re-sign

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Stan reply to GoSixers on Dec 7 at 12:35
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I would do it for a one year rental. A Howard-Jrue combo would make us competitive in the East. It's been a long time since the Sixers have been relevant. I wouldn't mind losing ET and Thaddeus for that. Plus after this year we could rebuild.

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Stan reply to Stan on Dec 7 at 12:43
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But that would force Howard to sign with NJ :(
But it keeps him away from LA :)

It would not make the sixers win a title - it would not make the sixers get to the NBA finals if you had to 'give up the farm' - hell they probably wouldn't make te ECF

And then you're screwed when he leaves for nothing.

It's a big splashy move - but if you give up everything to get howard - it's a waste of assets and a season and then what do you do?

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Stan reply to GoSixers on Dec 7 at 12:48
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If the assets are Thad and Turner, I can live with that. If Howard leaves after this year, then I would just rebuild with Jrue. Try my luck at Kevin Love and JaVale McGee and build through the draft.

If you think that the sixers can get dwight howard with only thaddeus young and turner that's a different story (I don't believe they can)

Your original statement was everyone on the roster (I removed our because i'm not a part of the sixers). And now you're saying thaddeus and Turner which is a worse offer than what the nets would offer and the Nets offer is laughable.

I believe ANY offer to the magic for dwight howard has to include Jrue Holiday or the Magic won't listen.


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Stan reply to GoSixers on Dec 7 at 12:57
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"If"

I would trade Turner, Thad, Iggy, Lou and whoever Orlando wants except Jrue. But I wouldn't take back any bad contracts. I'm not saying that this could happen, I'm just saying that this is my mentality. I can see teams trade for Howard even if its a just for a one year rental.

Any team that trades for howard as a one year rental that doesn't then have a shot at the Conference Finals (at least) and assets remaining on their roster is a dumb team in my opinion.

If you can get him 'cheap' cause it's a one year rental - fine - but the magic aren't going to trade him cheap - if they can only get 'rental' deals they'll keep him themselves most likely

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Stan reply to GoSixers on Dec 7 at 13:04
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But I'm not saying that Orlando would or should do this. I am just saying that I would be willing to give up some of our assets for just a one year rental.

Actually you said everything but Jrue :)

But I see what you're trying to do - I'll just have to not participate - it's not conversations I like to be part of

Jrue + Howard doesn't win you anything this year without them being surrounded with the right talent. Even if you add Howard for nothing the Sixers are at least a year or two away from being a championship contender. Remember Jrue is promising but it's not like he is a superstar right now. He needs to improve wuite a bit as well especially defensively.

I'm not really sure what your point is there but, um, ok

But if you keep other assets you can build around them, but I don't do a trade for Dwight Howard that doesn't get an extension, and I don't believe the Magic would consider dwight howard to the sixers without jrue holiday

I was replying to the "i would trade everyone but Jrue for Howard for a rental" idea. That doesn't make sense imo. If you can keep a respectable core, than maybe you can go for it, but giving up everyone is pointless.

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Stan reply to Xsago on Dec 7 at 13:01
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I'm not too high on Turner. I think he can be a 15-20ppg guy but not someone is going to be a cornerstone of this franchise.

That wasn't my idea :)

A 1 year rental is fine if you don't get stuck with bad contracts after he is gone.

It is one thing to have a good year with Howard and then a clean deck to rebuild. It is another to lose Howards only to be stuck paying Hedo for 3 more years.

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Stan reply to tk76 on Dec 7 at 12:50
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Does anyone know when the trade deadline is?

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deepsixersuede on Dec 7 at 13:37
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If Gold. St. gets Paul and amnesties Beidrens to acquire Chandler any interest in Beidrens here? [4 million per?] He is young, a shot blocker and could play next to Vuce.

I guess. But he would not be the answer for the athletic big they need.

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deepsixersuede reply to tk76 on Dec 7 at 14:15
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Two years from now if Jrue, Turner and Iggy blossom together a front court 4/5 rotation of Vuce, Biedrens and our 2012 1st rounder, hopefully, would be nice.

I think Biedrens is very athletic and Sam like and at least he would play inside, unlike the rest of our bigs.

Thorn may wait to see what bigs become available before resigning Thad and Hawes. What would you guys prefer; Thad at 9 million a year and Hawes or [Dunleavy or A.Thornton] and a legit center [Okafor, Kamen or Biedrens]

Okafor is the only guy you listed there worth having. Kaman is trash and Biedrins has serious mental issues (like, please don't give me the ball issues).

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deepsixersuede reply to Brian on Dec 7 at 14:26
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Compared to Thad and Hawes any of the 3 look good to me. A resigned Kamen, at a lower rate without giving up Iggy, Turner or Jrue would improve our team more than resigning Thad to as much money, in my opinion.

Sure. Having Kaman at 4 million is a lot better than having Hawes at the same price. But in no way should Kaman or Hawes be in our plans after this year.

And yes, I would rather have Hawes and Young instead of Al Thornton and Kaman. Young > Kaman + Thorton

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deepsixersuede reply to Stan on Dec 7 at 14:42
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If our organization feels Thad will start down the road I agree with you but a starting center, even Kamen, trumps a 6th man to me. Again, he would be my 3rd choice of the 3 I mentioned.

Biedrens would be my first because of age, price and fit. His unwillingness to want the ball doesn't bother me in the least, because a shotblocker that catches alleyoops and tip ins is needed here and he may provide that.

Kaman is basically Hawes with a longer leash in terms of the number of shots his coach allows him to take. Thad is a productive sixth man, which is more valuable than a starting center who is a drag on your entire team.

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deepsixersuede reply to Brian on Dec 7 at 14:48
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If both are on the market, same price tag, who gets more offers?

Thad.

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deepsixersuede reply to Brian on Dec 7 at 14:58
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I agree to disagree. Let me ask you this, who do you think Collins would want? I wish the sixers would rebuild and clear capspace and acquire picks but do you think Thorn and Collins feel that way?

I think a starting lineup of Kamen [renounce Hawes], Elton, Iggy, Turner and Jrue with a lower priced Thad replacement [R.Butler, A.Thornton, Dunleavy?] makes them more competative this season and feel Collins would prefer that, not that I agree with it.

Are we talking about kaman and thad or hawes and thad

No way hawes gets more than thad on the open market

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deepsixersuede reply to GoSixers on Dec 7 at 15:18
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Kamen vs. Thad ; What do other teams think of Thad? Does Denver see him as a p.f.?

I think they all see him as a tweener

I think thad would get more money than kaman as well due to injury history and career age

It wouldn't be unanimous. There are still a fair number of teams out there who judge players on idiotic things, like "WOW HE MADE AN ALL STAR TEAM!"

Then they deserve what they get and no CBA will save them

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deepsixersuede reply to GoSixers on Dec 7 at 18:15
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It seems the lack of quality bigs in the league tends to blind g.m.'s common sense. If Chandler, Nene and Gasol all get 15 m.p.y. or more that is lunacy. That is why I feel Kamen would get offers league wide and Sam may get 10 m.p.y. again.

no surprise here, @WojYahooNBA: Spurs have decided to use the amnesty clause on contract of RJefferson, per league sources . He has 3 years, $30M left.

lol. Why did they resign him in the first place? I wonder if they're going to blow everything up and trade Parker, Duncan and Ginobili.

I'd say I'm actually surprised. I'd like for the Sixers to bid on him, the man can score.

Caron Butler meeting w/ the Clips. I will seriously fall over laughing if wind up with Butler for like $36/4 out of this offseason.

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Stan reply to Brian on Dec 7 at 14:14
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I would start lamenting the loss of Thaddeus Young

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deepsixersuede reply to Brian on Dec 7 at 14:19
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To me it makes more sense than Chicago signing him to play shooting guard. But Prince seems like a lot better fit for the clippers, or G. Hill.

That and Chicago can only offer the MLE.

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deepsixersuede reply to Cin on Dec 7 at 14:35
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Yea, and the clippers need a veteran with all the young guys there with Iggy the perfect choice. If they fail in their big moves maybe the Minnesota pick becomes gettable, as someone mentioned earlier.

Found this stumbling through other similar fluff pieces...

http://www.slamonline.com/online/nba/2011/12/nba-five-trades-whats-in-it-for-us/

Love it. Steve Nash to the Lakers. Al Jefferson to the Thunder, because they have another 20 shots per game to spare.

They end with...

Trade No. 5:
Mavericks Acquire: Andre Iguodala
76ers Acquire: Andreis Biedrins, Ekpe Udoh, Rodrigue Beaubois, Dominique Jones, Mavericks Second-Round Pick
Warriors Acquire: Jason Kidd

If you follow the link you'll find their team-by-team rationale behind the trade. I love how the Mavericks and Warriors both get stars in this trade, and the 76ers get whatever garbage they both can spare.

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Sta reply to Cin on Dec 7 at 15:05
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It's better than Monte Ellis

Not by much

It'd be better if they could waive biedrins

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Cin reply to Sta on Dec 7 at 15:50
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I disagree. At least Ellis would be for two years, as opposed to Biedrins' three. Plus the 76ers would have to be solidly out the running for the playoffs for them to move Iguodala. Even then, they won't give him away for scraps.

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deepsixersuede reply to Cin on Dec 7 at 16:36
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Depends on what value Beaubois,Udoh and Dq. Jones have as far as young assets to our front office. Do they equal 2 future #1 picks adding that our pick would be better also after this trade.

Dq. Jones is an interesting s.g. option, compared to Meeks. And Beaubois may be retradeable. Udoh was highly thought of on this blog.

Beaubois has some potential but he's a 6-2 guard. We have Jrue, Turner, and Lou. Ekpe and Dominique haven't showed any potential and Beidrins is just a 10 million per year cap hit that we won't be able to get rid of until 2014.

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deepsixersuede reply to Stan on Dec 7 at 16:54
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Udoh's 1.5 blocks in 18 m.p.g. last year is pretty impressive but I doubt he becomes more than a 24 m.p.g. guy.

It is, but I wouldn't take on Biedrin's salary for that.

Hilarious. Trading Iggy for Cleveland's trade exception (i.e. nothing) would've been better than trading him Biedrins, who frankly should be amnestied. What a preposterous proposal!

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Tom Moore on Dec 7 at 17:02
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Story (with video): Evan Turner looks forward to playing more with Iguodala

http://bit.ly/sDXiXL

Biedrins has made 14 of his last 56 free throws. Incredible. No wonder he runs away from the ball on offense. What a tiger!

Chris Dudley's only 46. Maybe he could be lured out of retirement. Shoots it better than AB from charity stripe. Needs to complete a drop-step move he began in '02. Two birds with one stone.

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Stan reply to Dollar Bill on Dec 7 at 17:40
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Nah. I say we bring back Amal McCaskill and Zendon Hamilton

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Stan reply to Stan on Dec 7 at 17:45
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Those 2002-2005 rosters bring back memories

Greg Buckner
Zendon Hamilton
Amal McCaskill
Mark Bryant
Art Long
Brian Skinner
Michael Bradley
Kedrick Brown
Marc Jackson
Shavlik Randolph
Lee Nailon


Good times..good times

Now we have rumors that GSW will attempt to rent Paul for Ellis, and then try to flip Chandler and Curry for Howard later in the year in hopes that Paul will stay. I would rather have the Minnesota pick and junk than Ellis.

http://bayarea.sbnation.com/golden-state-warriors/2011/12/7/2618820/chris-paul-cp3-monta-ellis-golden-state-warriors-new-orleans-hornets-2011-nba-trade-rumors

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Stan reply to Tray on Dec 7 at 18:18
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Sorry. I can't take the title seriously "Chris Paul Trade Rumors: Warriors Willing To Deal Monta Ellis"

The sixers are willing to trade louis williams to get chris paul as well - you heard it here first

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Tray reply to Stan on Dec 7 at 19:19
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Like I said, I wouldn't do that if I were NOH but I'm sure GSW tried.

Ken Berger reports that the minimum salary for the first year will be 80% instead of 85%. It will be 85% in year 2 and 90% after that.

This is potentially huge for the Sixers. Less teams will be forced to spend and spend a lot to get to the minimum.

Apparently this was renegotiated with the B-list issues. They realized the damage they will do by getting to 85% in year 1

Shame they didn't realize what a stupid idea the salary floor is and how it's going to lead to some terrible contracts

I wonder if we're going to see a bunch of dumb 1 year contracts.

No doubt every year we'll see a bunch of dumb 1 year contracts - or you know really imbalanced contracts where a guy signs a 50 million dollar but gets like 20 of it (or whatever the max is) in one year and then less in the other years whereas another guy is maxed out in t a different year

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Stan reply to Xsago on Dec 7 at 20:01
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90%?? That's ridiculous.

90% isn't new - it's been the number since they agreed

Full MLE level deal for Chuck Hayes from Sacto. Not really the MLE, because they're way under the cap, but the equivalent (4years/$20M). Pretty stupid signing, if you ask me, but whatever. Guess they have to spend it.

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Da Jruth reply to Brian on Dec 7 at 21:04
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Really? Doesn't this guy kind of bring his own niche to a team like Thad does? But Thad is worth a couple million more?

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Stan reply to Da Jruth on Dec 7 at 21:13
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He's a quality player. 5 million (average NBA salary) is a decent price for him

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B6f5Uyu6Dv4

Stupid in that he's not going to move the needle for them. He'd probably be a decent get for a team that was going to at least approach a .500 record. As it is, they'll be paying him $5M when he's 33. And yeah, Thad's worth a couple mil more per year because he's five years younger with room to improve, his production is already at a solid level, and he isn't 5 inches undersized for his position.

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Da Jruth reply to Brian on Dec 7 at 22:26
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Oh, I see. Thought you meant the money was stupid when it seems to be reasonable when factoring in his rebounding and defense.

Chuck Hayes may be 5" undersized for his position, but he does have one, unlike Thad I guess.

Just random thinking from time to time about what this team needs as far as a new direction and all, I'd almost rather have a Chuck Hayes as a bench 4 instead of Thad. Especially for 5 mil a clip.
Curious as to whether Hayes gets to the line more than Thad -- he would almost have to by default, no?

Decent rebounder for a guy who is 6'6.

on a team with tons of holes and tons of youth - first stupid contract -

Oh yeah - the lakers are going to sign kpaono

I think Kapono could actually work on the Lakers. They have the front court to somewhat protect his horrible defense.

Bynum healthy - lakers serious finals contenders - bynum unhappy - not so much

Stephen A SMith was super funny tonight - listening to laker fans who DONT want to trade bynum for howard is so funny

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Stan reply to GoSixers on Dec 7 at 22:32
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Don't understand the logic. The only advantage Bynum has over Dwight is age- 2 years.

Defense- Howard
Offense- Howard
Athleticism- Howard
Health- Howard
Character- Howard

Laker fans aren't always that smart - some of them think they nee chris paul INSTEAD of howard :)

Remember, lakers jim buss reportedly only JUST agreed to be willing to trade bynum for howard - all reports indicate he was opposed to it last season

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deepsixersuede reply to GoSixers on Dec 7 at 22:47
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With two bigs that can't spell defense, Hayes is a perfect signing for Sacramento, in my opinion. They have plenty of scoring with Evans, Cousins and Hickson and the proper role players could improve them bigtime. Now they need a coaching change first, though.

He's a bench guy on a team that's how old? Are you going to use the 'good locker room presence' chit to try and justify them giving a bench guy 4 years on a team that is probably one of the youngest in the league?

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deepsixersuede reply to GoSixers on Dec 7 at 23:03
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When an organization invests a high pick in Cousins they would be smart to put high quality people around him and Adelman has been saying for years Hayes is the altimate pro. That aside, to me, Cousins and Hickson don't make sense together without a defender rotating with both of them and Hayes is a great defensive player.

I can't believe Cleveland picked Antwan Jamison over Amare just to keep JJ Hickson.

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Tray reply to Stan on Dec 7 at 23:16
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It was never clear to me whether there was really an Amare deal on the table or whether that was just an inaccurate rumor. If it was real, Cleveland really got what it deserved with LeBron's departure.

Atlanta's getting T-Mac for the minimum, I think. A nice little addition. He was very good some nights in Detroit.

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Stan reply to Tray on Dec 7 at 22:35
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He's basically 6-8 jump shooter. Shame, he was one of my favorite players growing up

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Tray reply to Stan on Dec 7 at 22:36
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As a scorer, yeah that's all he has left, but he's still a great passer. Some games last year he played a very good point.

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Stan reply to Tray on Dec 7 at 22:40
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Yup. He could have been a great player. He was putting up Lebron numbers at the age of 24.

But he's not going to come close to replacing Crawford's production

Yeah but crawford thinks he's worth way too much money and shoots too much

T-Mac - even before he got hurt perpetually - had some playoff performance issues

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Tray reply to Stan on Dec 7 at 23:03
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Replacing Crawford's production isn't the idea here. The idea is just some wing/PG depth. Especially if they continue to not play Teague.

I think Teague is the starter.

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Tray reply to Brian on Dec 8 at 0:40
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I'm not sure that they won't go and start Hinrich. Didn't they not play Teague until the playoffs?

Hinrich is hurt. Last I read was Hinrich was going to be the backup, and they were looking for another backup for Teague until he gets back (going to miss like a month, minimum).

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Tray reply to Brian on Dec 8 at 3:38
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Yeah, on the other backup thing I saw Hollinger tweet that they may sign Earl Watson.

How does GS have cap space every despite the stupid contracts they give out- Ellis, Biedrins, Maggette, Lee

Cause they are bad deals for who the players are but not max bad deals

They also don't have tons of cap room

it's only like 7 mil ish

http://www.storytellerscontracts.info/resources/11-12salaries.htm

Excellent page to know

Does anyone else feel like we are going to lose Thad? The stupid salary floor forces so many teams to overpay.

It hasn't forced anyone to do anything, yet. Though I think the floor has a lot to do with the Wizards not using the amnesty on Rashard Lewis. If they used it on him, they'd have to spend money on someone they don't really want/need in order to get up to the floor, and they'd still be paying Lewis.

As i understand it, for teams under the salary cap if they amnesty a player, the players salary can still count towards the cap if they choose so. So even if the Wizards amnesty Lewis they can still be reasonably close to the minimum. Actually this 80% limit changes things quite a bit, they might be even over the limit, need to check that...

what up sober. I unfortunately think the Sixers will re-sign Thad with a massive overpayment. I like Thad, and would be happy to keep him at 4/$20M, but that seems highly unlikely, so I'm actually hoping your question turns out to be true.

I don't see them amnestying Lewis. Only has 2 years left and isn't a headcase. I expect them to save the amnesty to potentially use it next year on Blatche if he has another season of middling performance and poor attitude.

As i understand it the dangerous teams for signing Thad to a big contract are Denver, Sacramento and Indiana. Sacramento is unlikely, after signing Chuck Hayes their front court is crowded. Denver and Indiana are the ones to watch.

Washington, Houston and New Jersey are the other teams that can sign him to a big contract, but Houston and New Jersey have bigger things in mind and i believe Washington will save the cap space for next year.


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