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Keep On Keepin' On

I'm kind of sad I didn't get to see Avery Bradley completely destroy Jameer Nelson last night w/ his defense.

I watched the highlights of that game, good god, I know it's only one game, but what the hell?

He isn't a trusted shooter and by what I've seen doesn't have a prayer at the rim, but my word, that guy is fun to watch get around. Long, lean, and active.

Rich reply to Brian on Jan 24 at 14:31

Crazy that this was the first game Bradley didn't destroy the Celtics with his own offense.

I can't believe that score though. Been reading some Boston stuff today, apparently the C's are BACK.

Flip just got fired. That's the second notch on the belt for Kentucky draft class 2010.

Unsurprising - hell i thought he'd be gone by the first sixers/wizards game.

I don't think this is at the foot of John Wall as much as Westphal - that whole roster is a mess - PLUS Flip wasn't the right coach for it anyway

Honestly - get a hard ass in there - not larry brown hard ass but someone old school enough to have the clout to tell them to STFU

The writing was on the wall yesterday in the first half down 30 to a team missing their top two centers.

Stan reply to Brian on Jan 24 at 12:13

Your Sixers caused a good man to lose his job. I hope you're proud.

Yeah, i fell bad for flip saunders, he will now be paid large amounts of cash to sit on his ass

You guys like Flip?!?

That guy has to be one of the whiniest coaches in the league.

Reading IF fundamental

Comprehension however is even more so

Stan reply to dwight on Jan 24 at 12:32

I think he's a decent coach. He had a lot of success with Minnesota and Detroit. It's really hard to coach a team whose roster was designed for Eddie Jordan.

Charlie H reply to Stan on Jan 24 at 14:10

I agree. Flip's a really good coach. He's not a miracle worker. You gotta have players, and to have players, you need a good GM. Ernie Grunfeld is not a good GM.

Is rod thorn a good gm?

Jason M reply to GoSixers on Jan 24 at 14:52

Well, considering Thorn did nothing to put this team together, it doesn't really matter what kind of GM he is.

You don't consider the addition of Craig Brackins something significant? How dare you?

But it does, and thorn has done some things

Charlie H reply to GoSixers on Jan 24 at 23:51

And that is relevant how? Oh wait, I know - I was supposed to say how bad a GM Rod Thorn is because Flip Saunders is a much better coach than DC. Right?

I know this is a pointless discussion, but I don't think there's a comparison between Wall's culpability and Cousins

Well, since it's verboten to view Wall as anything other than a victim, I'm sure none of the blame for this will land on his shoulders either. It's a blessed life.

Never said he was a victim.

But one superstar had a long standing public confrontation with a coach to the point where it was an either/or

The other simply wasn't able to elevate a roster of nimrods and lazy asses to relevance.

Many top picks go to horrible teams who go through coaches. That doesn't mean they got them fired.

Did Kevin Love get McHale, Wittman, or Rambis fired? Did Durant get Carlesimo or Brooks fired?

Well, Rambis got fired, in part, because he wouldn't play Love. Durant was pretty underwhelming while Carleisimo was there. You could make the case they had a hand in the demise of their coaches, but neither was a headcase which both Wall and Cousins seem to be. Or one seems to be a headcase, the other seems just clueless.

Did you just call Cousins and Wall superstars?

Yeah, but if you've been following me, you clearly know I don't believe Cousins is (or ever will be) a superstar. It was a poor choice of words, was probably thinking of something else while typing. I meant more top draft pick.

Quit deflecting.

Heh. My point is Wall won't take any heat for any of this, for some odd reason. I'm just wondering when the chosen one label gets replaced with a more accurate moniker.

Young players always get the benefit of the doubt, until they've been proven unworthy.

Remember when Zach Randolph was the messiah in Portland? `

My point wasn't whether or not Wall has achieved what the Wizards hoped he would, but that his culpability is vastly different than Cousins and the two situations aren't really comparable.

Charlie H reply to Derek Bodner on Jan 25 at 0:06

Evan Turner didn't. People were calling him a bust in training camp last season. Chauncey Billups didn't when he was the 3rd pick in the draft. #1 overall picks do. Players annointed by Stern & the NBA's sponsors do. I know what you're saying, but it's only some players who get this status. Danny Manning for example. The guy was never much above average, but almost until the day he retired, he was considered a star. On the other hand, it took about a year for Pervis Ellison to be labelled a bust. I know Manning was better, but Pervis got no benefit of the doubt. I can see Wall drifting for years, never improving, while everybody keeps trying to convince themselves he's a star.

Well said CH, you are on point.

Rich reply to Brian on Jan 24 at 16:06

The thing I don't get about it is that everyone excuses the point guard for his team's poor basketball IQ (Poor John Wall..), and boy do they stink. Think though, Cousins plays on a team that's on a historic pace for lowest assist to turnover ratio, so it's not like he's botching a perfect situation. I just think that Wall definitely has some fault here, and isn't a victim. Really, the Kings are a really tough team to watch, just like Washington.

Really too, with the positions they play, Wall should be able to impact the rest of his team more than Cousins. How much, well that's up for debate.

Cousins generally has the ability to get his offense himself. His role is primarily offensive rebounding and (sadly) making the 15 footer, sprinkled with some face-up drives. As long as he gets the ball, there's not a whole lot of timing or people being in the right place necessary. Could he be helped by some better floor spacing, or a great pick and roll passer? Sure. But it's not the crux of his problem, either the smaller one (basketball production) or the bigger one (attitude).

If players are constantly out of position, failing to run the called plays, or lacking basketball intelligence, it's going to be difficult for a point guard to improve their play. Wall's assists are generally because of attention he receives, less so than structured offense. From what I've seen of the Wizards, I don't think Blatche, Young, McGee or Crawford are capable (mentally) of running a structured offense, and this will affect a point guard tremendously.

My stance on the Wizards since half-way through his rookie year was that it's nearly impossible to scout Wall in his current environment, either in a positive or negative light. That team needs to be gutted.

Wall hasn't shown he's capable of running a structured offense, either.

There's a little bit of chicken and egg going on here, isn't there?

And how does that have any relevance to what I stated? I'm not arguing whether Wall has proven he can. Seems any response I make will only come back with a return volley denigrating Wall rather than debating my point.

Here's our fundamental disagreement, imo. You see Wall's teammates as completely lacking in basketball IQ. I see the entire Wizards team as completely lacking in basketball IQ, and general IQ. I actually think Javale McGee might "get it" more than Wall does, and even if they're equally IQ-challenged, McGee can still be a productive pro based on the position he plays, and the fact that you can dumb the game down for big men. If you dumb it down for point guards, you wind up with an offense like the Wizards.

Not 100% accurate. I see an inability to even judge Wall's IQ (basketball or otherwise) or potential in his current situation.

Fair enough. I've seen nothing to indicate the story would be different if Wall had smarter teammates, in fact, I think he'd drag them down as well.

Da Jruth reply to Brian on Jan 24 at 21:58

Wall spent too much time playing in the S.J.G. Greater NC Pro-Am aka the "Mecca of Summer League Basketball" this past summer. Too similar and reminiscent of his AAU days playing for D-One Sports. Run 'n gun, showboat 'n gloat; grin and mug for the posse. Bad habits abound. Beneficial to have been runnin' thru a Two Ball and 10 spot shooting drill for that month. Hammin' it up was better nutrients for the ego, not the game.

John Schuhmann weighs in on John Wall.

Fair points on Cousins, but again I believe a point guard should really be able to make his teammates better, regardless. That's why I can see why people are frustrated with Jrue this year. Wall has not made any of those guys better.

A player that's thought of as highly as Wall needs to be taken to task for the point that:

A. He is unbelievably extremely inefficient with his offense, and that won't change much if he can't remedy that jumper. It could come, but he clearly needs to work on that. Unless he plays with the Boston Celtics of the past two years, I haven't seen a point guard be as dominant as people still think he will be with that poor of a jumper. Yeah, he could still be a very good player, but your ceiling is only so high with that shot. And that ceiling doesn't hit "Potentially best PG in the league."

B. From when I've seen the Sixers play him, he's let people get into the lane way too much. I was really impressed with his defense last year. I have no numbers to back this up, but he's gotten lazy on that end as well this year, where he should be a force. That has nothing to do with his team.

C. His turnovers aren't on his team. He's out of control a lot on the fastbreak and in the halfcourt. I agree with Brian that he hasn't shown the ability to run a structured offense.

Better? Yes. Smarter? That's a much tougher proposition.

But was wall thought of highly because of his ability to make his teammates better - did he do a lot of that in his one year in college or was he just really fast and college players couldn't stop him but once he gets to the nba his advantage is severely limited and he's exposed as more of an athelte than a basketball player?

He was a very good passer in college (and high school). The other main weaknesses in his game (mid-range and turnovers) have carried over to a T, though.

You know the college game more than I do, but it seems every time i watch John Wall play he isn't passing much and at least once or twice a game he's passing the ball to someone who isn't there any more He doesn't seem to be progressing in his second year and that can't ALL be on flip can it?

I put it mostly on Ernie Grunfeld

You put John Wall not showing improvement year one over year two on the GM?

It's pretty much the same crap he played with last year (isn't it?) - why is he worse?

Rich reply to GoSixers on Jan 24 at 17:23

Look at his strengths on Draft Express. I would have agreed with pretty much all of them coming out of school. Now half of them could go in the other category.

He still could be a very good player, but he needs the right team around him. I think some people who say Poor John Wall don't really understand that a player who gets the "Poor" label should pretty much have demonstrated an ability to win pretty much regardless of the team around him. Maybe you'd say "Poor Dwyane Wade" when the Heat stunk that one year.

What's the word on Hawesome and the Voose?

Are they back in the mix on Wednesday? I agree with your assessment that we must win these next three games.


David Thrope chat in 5 minutes


Follow live as he answers more questions about the second and third place team in the Atlantic then the first place team (if he answers any)

Flip's won a lot of games but he's got the charisma of a cardboard box. Anybody who's racked up 3 70% W-L NBA seasons knows his way around a tavern napkin. Picked the wrong city to rejuvenate his career; only 2 things are missing in Washington - winning talent and a discernible scheme. John Wall needs accompaniment and a set of brake pads. President Grunfeld hasn't been the same since "The Ernie & Bernie Show" went dead in the mid-70s. Where is Agent Zero?

Stephen Jackson, not fired up to play Hawks last night: 27:59 0-1 0-0 0-0 1 rb 2 A 0 pts

Coach Skiles, I coulda done that for a lot less money.

I don't think Saunders is a bad coach. He is pretty good but was a horrible fit with the Wizards. What that team need is an authoritative person who can instill the basics of the NBA and not a detail oriented coach best suited to coach veteran teams with high BB IQ players.

You could also make the argument that Eddie Jordan was a good coach but just a bad fit with the Sixers.

Good coaches are able to adjust their philosophy to fit the talent of the team.

Al Davis and Memphis Marreese: "Just win, baby!" Grizz 7 straight; @Portland tonight.

Did you see this report from Philly Burbs http://www.phillyburbs.com/sports/sixers/team-plans-to-take-look-at-elson/article_b4c8c264-a92b-5a05-92b0-d4176b04e045.html saying the Sixers may sign Francisco Elson but are also working out other big men? Does anyone know anything else?

I read they weren't going to work out Dampier.

I think I'd prefer him to Elson.

I would prefer him to play Allen.

Wow. Not good news. Spencer's injury must be worse than what they thought.

Comments made by Collins made it sound like Hawes could/would be out this entire week. Not sure about Vuc. He seemed more ready.

I'd like to congratulate the detroit tigers for reminding us that stupid GMs exist in many sports

OK - so they're excited - ok then

this is a basketball blog, dipshit

your opinions on baseball free agency would be better posted on a differnet forum

at least your inane musings about your fantasy team are basketball-related...

I have a quick question for you

Is this your blog?

It's mine, and I really wish people would stay on point and stop being so bitchy.

Amare + Chandler for Howard and Hedo. Otis might be dumb enough to do it.

Wouldn't shock me. The best thing that could happen for the Sixers this season is for the Magic to play well enough that Smith thinks they have a chance at winning the title. If he thinks that, he won't trade Howard. Then the Sixers can do their best sales job in the summer to get him as a free agent.

Of course, selling Howard on Philly would probably involve Thorn taking a different stance from the "If he's interested in us, he would've called" he's become fond of.

PHANMAN reply to Brian on Jan 24 at 18:33

what is the max we could potentially offer Howard next year?

If they amnesty Brand, they can offer him a max contract. I think only Orlando could offer him more.

I don't know if that's a trade Otis would do - I think it's just one the Knicks proposed and thus knick nation thinks it'll happen - reports are that cause of chandlers contract it couldn't happen until after march 1.

What's the trade deadline this year?

Stan reply to GoSixers on Jan 24 at 18:29

March 15th

Stan reply to Brian on Jan 24 at 18:34

"Deron Williams' first choice is to stay with the Nets and to build something special in Brooklyn, but if it doesn't work out with his current team"

We would have no shot at signing Dwight.

Turtle Bay reply to Stan on Jan 24 at 18:47

I wouldn't put too much weight in that quote. Deron is trying to say the right things, but he can't be happy with how the Nets have performed this year, and I wouldn't be surprised if he wants out.

Yeah - it's his first choice - but if they don't get dwight in trade - watch him walk

It would be up to Thorn/Harris/Collins/Fresh Prince to convince Dwight he'll have a better chance of winning a title w/ a formed team that plays sick defense instead of playing with Deron Williams and basically nothing else.

I'd start by explaining to him if he goes to Brooklyn, he's always going to be playing for a second-class franchise, the Knicks own the town. He's also going to be splitting the spotlight w/ Williams on his own team.

Then I'd explain to him that he'll be a legend in Philly forever if he wins a championship there, he'll be the unquestioned face of the franchise, and it's a franchise that actually means something. I'd explain how much money Harris has, and how much of it he's willing to spend to make sure the Sixers remain a legitimate contender his entire time in Philly. Finally, I'd have Doug Collins sit down with him and explain to him exactly how playing for the Sixers, with their players, will make him the most dominant force in the game today.

If he still wants to waste what's left of his prime chasing a pipe dream in Brooklyn, that's on him.

I'd counter with there's more chance to be a hero in brooklyn, the clippers are no ascendant in LA, the knicks are terrible so the time is ripe for a change, and there's more promotional dollar opportunity and 'q rating' being on a new york team (even in lowly brooklyn) than playing in philadelphia where the fans will boo you every time you miss a free throw

There seem to be a lot of reports that indicate to me that Dwight is a little fragile - shaq comparisons make him afraid to go to LA - etc... - he seems like a guy who couldn't handle the booing - and the inevitable radio idiocy

Dwight Howard would be a near unmatched generational icon in Philly - sports or otherwise. He'd be just another face in NY.

It really isn't going to matter whether the Nets are better than the Knicks are, on the court. You'll get a decent fan base from people in Brooklyn, but the Nets will never overtake the Knicks as this city's basketball team.

I could talk about this for hours, but the Nets situation essentially boils down to this:

1) They have virtually no entrenched fan base in New Jersey, the few fans they do have will not go to Brooklyn to see them play basketball. Most of them barely cross the Hudson, let alone the East River.
2) People who live in Manhattan view Brooklyn as a curiosity they visit maybe once a year to eat at a restaurant they saw written up in the NY Times. The Nets won't draw any fans from Manhattan, it's just not going to happen.
3) No one will travel from any suburb north of the city to go to Nets games in Brooklyn.

Brooklynites will probably support the team, but outside of a few neighborhoods, there really isn't a lot of money in Brooklyn. You're not going to get big firms buying season tickets, you aren't going to have Wall Street guys expensing four tickets to take clients to see the Nets, because those guys wouldn't dare take clients to the hinterlands. It's going to be an extremely insular fan base, which is fine, they'll probably draw decent crowds because a lot of hoops fans are essentially frozen out of the Garden by the high ticket prices and douchebags who pack the place, but as far as Q rating goes, well, I think there's going to be more cache in being a pitcher for the Mets than a center for the Nets. So maybe Dwight can land a Vitamin Water commercial with the Situation.

Anyway, he's going to do what he wants to do, obviously. I just find it kind of laughable that people are all of a sudden considering the Nets a viable destination with that roster. The Nets probably had a better chance of carving out a bigger market west of the Hudson than they will east of the East.

Imagine how much of legend one would be if one won a title for brooklyn before the knicks could...maybe spike remembers his favorite city and is also a nets fan

and as for the 'generational icon' hyperbole that was spouted above by someone else


new york is more of a bsketball city as a whole than philadelphia - i don't buy that the nets being better AND winning a title wouldn't sway new yorkers who currently have to watch games in MSG - which needs upgrades don't it?

Iverson was a bigger star than anyone the Knicks have ever had, nationally.

Sorry - the transitive property doesn't work - Iverson was a timing thing and his personality would have made him a bigger star at the time anywhere - my problem with dwight is that he seems to want to be a 'star' but to me his personality as it's shown publicly is anything but that - to me he wants to be kareem - great - but not really out there glad handing as much

I don't really get that, he seems like more of a ham to me, but it doesn't really matter. If he goes to Brooklyn, he's going to live in obscurity, like the Mets always have. Even when the Mets were winning titles and the Yanks sucked, the Yanks were the premiere franchise, the Mets were a curiosity for people from Queens and losers from the suburbs to root for.

My point w/ Iverson, and really Barkley as well, is that being in Philly doesn't stop superstars from going national. Playing for the Nets, kind of does. Jason Kidd was basically forgotten when he played for the Nets, and he took them to the finals twice.


Lovely superiority complex. Unfortunately just saying balderdash isn't actually conveying an actual point.

It conveys that your opinion of what dwight howard would become in philadelphia is what I think of it - it's balderdash - you provided no points to discount - but it's baldderdash

Ron Jaworski never won a ring - he's bigger in the city than half the phillies who were on the world series team that just won a couple years ago

Rich reply to GoSixers on Jan 24 at 21:51

Ron Jaworski was a quarterback that also happened to be very visible in his post-playing career. That's why he's bigger than half those guys.

Allen Iverson never won a ring and he's huge in Philly. Dwight Howard would be a huge deal wherever he goes.

That's an irrelevant arguement per the topic of conversation.

My point is simply inferred but I will spell it out. No singular entity is bigger than the city of New York. Alex Rodriguez isn't even bigger than the Yankees, much less the city This is not the case with a lesser city like Philadelphia. Allen Iverson was bigger than just the city, but it was also because of the catalyzing nature of the city that his persona was universally known. In my opinon, Dwight Howard's charisma is on the level of Iverson's attitude.

Also, have you spent time in Philly amongst its youth or even played basketball there in the last decade? It's still all Iverson. Nobody really cares about Jaws, Rollins, or Utley because baseball and football programs are too expensive to run.

As for the booing and the talk radio, all he needs to do is average 20 pts/game, which shouldn't be a problem.

But the sixers work a lot in transition and running - how would dwight feel about that - can he keep up?

MCT reply to Brian on Jan 24 at 20:57

I would add that he can be the anti-Shaq by coming to Philly. Shaq went to Hollywood, he can come to the blue-collar town (fits his game). The Lakers have had Mikan, Wilt, Kareem, and Shaq. The Sixers have had Wilt, Moses, Dikembe (ok he's not exactly on the same level as the rest) and now Dwight.

This franchise has had two of the top 10 teams in NBA history:


7 of the 50 greatest players:


And another on "The next 10" list (Iverson):


Then I would show him HD footage of our home games during the 2001 playoff run to see just how crazy this town was for the Sixers that year (if that doesn't exist, call in George Lucas or James Cameron to CGI that shit).

Tray reply to Brian on Jan 24 at 21:05

I sincerely believe he'd be wasting his prime coming to a team where (a) he's forced to be the go-to option, (b) his Robin would be Jrue Holiday.

So you believe that if the sixers subtracted elton brand (and hawes) but added only dwight howard they aren't a title contender?

Seriously - that's just ridiculous

Well, he really wouldn't be coming here to be the go-to guy. He'd be coming here to be a piece of the puzzle, probably the most-important piece, but the draw is that he wouldn't have to build something out of nothing, which he's had to do in Orlando and he'd have to do in New Jersey as well. If he comes to Philly, he plays with three or four guys who can set him up for easy hoops, a coach who really knows the x's and o's and a team that's already one of the best defensive teams in the league. They wouldn't need him to do anything he doesn't already do, on either end of the floor, to be a legitimate contender. If he goes to NJ, he's going to have to play 45 minutes/night, cover for two or three non-NBA players in the starting lineup alone, and score a lot more than he does right now.

Rich reply to Tray on Jan 24 at 21:57

First off, that would be better than having to rebound Kobe Bryant's 16 misses a night.

He'd be wasting his time being the final piece and forming a possibly historic defensive team? Come on now, if this team has Dwight Howard right now without Brand they are on equal footing with Miami and Chicago. It's not his only option, but it would not be wasting his prime. They'd be a contender year in and year out.

Speights is averaging 4.6 DEFENSIVE rebounds per game in less than 23 minutes, 6.4 total. That's pretty good.
I must say the first number surprises me a bit, he never did that as a Sixer. He would have helped now.
And I still think we need a back up "pure" PG, defensive minded, Ollie/Ivey-type (possibly better, lol). Just in case. Not sure what Brackings is there for, he's useless.

Hey Brian, Great job with the site love reading and the show you do with Derek. So 3-13 last year and 12-4 through sixteen games this year do you think they could win 50? I guess that would be 50 and 16.Also who is the next player the sixers are going to throw a max deal at if you could, i mean Dwight Howard would be the guy but after that who else would be worth a max deal and would take the team to another level?

So what's everyone watching - magic/pacers or knicks/bobcats?

Wow, Magic didn't pick up Daniel Orton's option. I thought he was supposed to be a long-term project. Did injuries really ruin him that much?

Looks like it's gonna be 4y/62M for Love.


Wow. That's shocking. They really low-balled him. I thought maybe he'd insist on a shorter deal, like LeBron and Wade did, so he had an out.

Well, there goes option 1A.

all the talk about how 4 60 wasn't enough and suddenly 4/62 is? Something fishy

Tom Moore on Jan 24 at 20:55

Story (with Hawes, Collins video interviews): Sixers trying to show they're a 'marquee' team:


Tray reply to Tom Moore on Jan 24 at 21:02

Kind of ironic that Hawes is interviewed in a story about our potential marquee status.

Orlando crushed the Pacers. Think they might've been a tad upset after their showing against the Celts.

How the hell did THIS heat team run the sixers out of the freaking building - this is pathetic

It was the second night of a back-to-back, they didn't have Hawes, lost Voose in the third quarter and Collins threw in the towel early in the fourth when they probably had a run left in them.

khouse reply to Brian on Jan 24 at 21:28

It won't happen again...Francisco Elson will make certain of that lol!

Love is sort of denying he's signing the deal tomorrow:

@kevinlove: If you read it on the Internet it must be true right? #sarcasm

JeffFoote410day on Jan 24 at 22:11

In case Thorn's reading I'll work out tomorrow...... on second thought maybe I should call him?

..scrolling through contacts..Rodney King Thorn..there he is ..... shucks, he's been sleep since dusk..maybe Francisco knows his home number..??? ...scrolling contacts again..

Love your moniker as I've been beating the Jeff Foote drum for awhile as he certainly offers more than Elson who is the same decripit age as Battie but is even a worse player! It's funny but from this idiocy one can conclude that the only upside our FO can see are in the players we select in the draft...hilarious!

JeffFoote410day reply to khouse on Jan 25 at 9:30

Can someone possibly beat it louder? I can be developed and coached just as it was believed Jeff Pendergraph, Solomon Alabi, Keith Benson, and even your very own Lavoy Allen could be developed from the last 3 drafts. Maybe I can offer you a tip of upgrading from a snare to a bass :-)

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