DFDepressed FanDepressed Fan

All  

Sixers

, all the time

The Opportunities Should Be There

i think the nba made their stats page public today

nba.com/stats

Kenny 'the jet' was on ESPN Radio this morning praising it as a way to be able to determine what a 'clutch' player is because you can look at time left and point differential and a players performance

Kenny has never heard of small sample size and the concept of noise in statistics.

he also kind of mocked any one who would do the kind of work required to make this available

Interesting split for Jrue. Look at how he performs in clutch to close games (with the lead) vs. when they're trying to come back in crunch time (trailing).

I'll take a look at it close this weekend. It looks nice on a first glance.

Why is there no FIRE DOUG COLLINS option? I've grown very tired of his coaching style and negative interviews.

It seems like the Nets are involved in every trade rumor. They've been reportedly "interested" in every decent player on the market yet they don't have much in assets to give away.

That's pretty much been their moto since Prokhorov took over.

Nice to hear we've been "engaged" in conversations about Bargnani.

How many years does he have left on his deal?

Nevermind, 2 more after this year. Also a trade kicker. Ugh.

user-pic
Stan reply to Brian on Feb 16 at 0:20
+/-

I can't believe I'm saying this, but I'd rather keep Hawes.

Is Bargs even going to be able to shoot? Weren't his latest injury problems in the elbow on his shooting arm?

user-pic
Tray reply to Stan on Feb 16 at 1:18
+/-

I completely agree. Hawes rebounds, at least, and he does serve a function of sorts on offense.

I think the Hawks are trying to a build a front court with Horford and Howard. I doubt Horford is available.

I'd give up anyone on this team except for Jrue in exchange for Horford. 26 years old and only making $12 million/year.


This gave me a good laugh:
"With the trade deadline looming, speculation has turned up the possibility that Philadelphia would send Evan Turner and Spencer Hawes to Atlanta for soon-to-be unrestricted free agent Josh Smith. [But] such a deal would not interest the 76ers, according to two league sources with knowledge of the situation. "Why would the Sixers be interested in making a deal for a player who can walk at the end of the season and leave them holding nothing but the bag?" one source said. "I don't see where that makes sense for them." Although the Sixers would acquire Smith's Larry Bird rights -- meaning they could sign him to a more lucrative deal than any other team -- they would have no guarantee that Smith would re-sign with them."

can we all at least agree to ignore every rumor that doesn't come from that Woj guy bc he is the only one Thorn talks to?

Sorry this is sort of off-topic.

Just saw that Mo Cheeks is a finalist for the HOF again, as is Gary Payton who I think is a lock (at some point, if not in his first year of eligibility).

Any chance Mo gets in someday? If not this year then down the road? I know his stats aren't sexy at first glance, but he did do some impressive things. This is how he stacks up against Payton and Kidd through 15 seasons (Mo's entire career):

http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/pcm_finder.cgi?request=1&sum=1&p1=cheekma01&y1=1993&p2=kiddja01&y2=2009&p3=paytoga01&y3=2005#totals::none


They shot/scored a great deal more obviously, but I think he stacks up pretty well as a PG and defensively. Their numbers are even closer in the playoffs. If the HOF voters are looking at advanced stats yet, he even better. Although I understand that longevity counts as well and they both played more years/games than he did.

I am too biased to judge, what are your honest opinions on it?

user-pic
Tray reply to MCT on Feb 15 at 20:31
+/-

I think that raw counting stats have some meaning. Cheeks's per-minutes numbers compare favorably, but he only played 31 minutes a game, which is why he only averaged 11 and 6 over his career. I doubt there are many hall of famers with those raw numbers, or many hall of famers who only played 31 minutes a game. And it's not like that number is really a function of a long tail to his career; outside of 3 seasons in the prime of his career, and one season in which he played 50 games for the Spurs, Cheeks always played 33 minutes or less a game. I was surprised to see how efficient he was, but then, his usage was really low.

user-pic
Charlie H reply to MCT on Feb 16 at 12:03
+/-

I'm biased too - he's just about my favorite player of all time. And I think he should be in.

The minutes/game number is skewed by the fact that he was a sub for the last few years of a long career. He led the league in minutes played once. He was the best defensive point guard in the league for about 5 years. He shot 52% for his career, an amazing stat for a 6'1" guy who wasn't a jump shooting specialist. I honestly don't think he'll get in because his numbers aren't great overall - regular season anyway; his playoff stats usually spiked upward pretty dramatically. His value was in the intangibles - how he ran that high-powered offense, his on the ball defense (as shown by his incredible performances against Magic Johnson in '82 - '83), and his uncanny ability to decide when to shoot, when to pass, when to drive to the basket. (Don't remember him ever missing a layup in traffic.) He defended passing lanes as well as any small man ever and turned steals and rebounds into layups in seconds. He was fearless, smart, unselfish, and a leader on the floor. A consummate professional and a joy to watch.

user-pic
Charlie H on Feb 16 at 12:06
+/-

Anybody else think Garnett for DeAndre and Eric Bledsoe is a good deal for the Celtics? Garnett is close to done, and Jordan is a young center who's probably among the top 6 in the league.

Ok, so i like that deal for the Celtics because they can't realistically contend with their current team and Garnett is not part of their future. However, Jordan is far from a top 6 center in the league. He is backup center on a good team. Until he learns how to shoot free throw he can't even become a legit rotation player IMO, let alone more.

user-pic
Tray reply to Xsago on Feb 16 at 14:47
+/-

So why is it even a good deal for them? Rondo's still a better player than Bledsoe.

user-pic
Javier reply to Tray on Feb 16 at 17:25
+/-

Well Bledsoe is not as good as rondo right now, but he's younger, & way more athletic with a high ceiling, he's already good & would flourish more with a starting job & good coaching, plus they get a young athletic center with upside too... They could than use rondo to bring in additional assets like prospects/picks, idk just an idea

At worst, he is a good trade asset. At best he is a part of their future and they can trade Rondo for another star at a different position. And they are not really losing anything because Garnett is not a part of their future and they are not winning this year no matter what they do.

user-pic
Tray reply to Xsago on Feb 16 at 22:05
+/-

I'm not sure that, with some creative general managing, they can't have an outside shot at contention with Garnett next season.

Will Purdue and Bill Wennington were starters on very good teams

That didn't make them good players

That was supposed to go to charlie

user-pic
Charlie H reply to GoSixers on Feb 20 at 10:33
+/-

That's beside the point. The guy said Jordan is a "backup center on a good team." Then he said he's not even a legit rotation player, which is a ridiculous statement. I disagree, that's all. I didn't say that starting on a good team "makes him a top 5 center." It does make him a legit rotation player. I just think he's in the top 6 of guys playing right now. I can't think of 6 better ones unless you count Bynum and Garnett. I guess I should include Garnett because he has been playing center for about a year now, but I left Bynum out because he's never gonna play again. One thing for sure, Jordan is way better than Kendrick Perkins. One guy I forgot about is Gortat. I'd rate him higher than Jordan, I guess.

I'm confused, is he a good rotation player or top 6 in the league?

Regardless, including Jordan in a Garnett deal is bad for the clippers, and that's why they are turning down offers that include him (assuming KG ever stops off his high horse and realizes he's no longer wanted in boston and refusing the trade is only hurting the franchise he claims to love cause he 'bleeds green' though money is green too)

user-pic
Charlie H reply to Xsago on Feb 18 at 17:25
+/-

Isn't he the starting center on a very good team?

Let's see whose better: Howard, Chandler, Gasol, Garnett, uh.... Bynum???

Kendrick Perkins is the starting center on an even better team. Does that make him a top 5 center?


In addition to the guys you listed there trying adding these guys who are better than Jordan (off the top of my mind): Duncan, the other Gasol, Varejao, Lopez, Noah, Pekovic, Al Jefferson, Nene, Monroe, Gortat, Hibbert, Asik, Splitter, Favors, Vucevic, Okafor, ... and i'm sure there are many more... Jordan is not even a top 20 center, let alone top 6. Just because he is atheltic doesn't mean he can play.

And he doesn't even finish games... But he does start them. Jordan is a really a poor man's McGee.

user-pic
Tray reply to Xsago on Feb 18 at 18:37
+/-

People don't realize it, but this is a pretty good era for centers. If you think back ten years ago, things were way worse. Jamaal Magloire was actually one of the more promising centers around. Rasho Nesterovic started for two playoff teams. The best scorer in the league was playing with Andrew DeClerq. Raef LaFrentz had a huge deal. More generally, there were all these guys on rosters who couldn't really do anything and were signed solely because they could supposedly match up physically with Shaq.

anybody else watching our guy JRUUUUEEEEEE?

user-pic
Javier reply to das411 on Feb 16 at 21:12
+/-

Almost brings a tear to my eye, shining bright spot of the season

The long two did Jrue in. Fitting :)

user-pic
eddies' heady's on Feb 17 at 10:41
+/-

No news yet? Oh well, still 13 hours and 19 minutes left for My Cousin Turner's (MCT) proclamation to hopefully come true. Get busy Tony! Somebody wake Rod's ass up!

huh? the trade deadline isnt til thursday

What's your, " Cousin Turner's (MCT) proclamation" if you don't mind me asking, I'm curious as I'm anxiously waiting (& hoping) for a Turner trade -fingers crossed- & any corresponding news!

user-pic
MCT reply to Javier on Feb 17 at 20:18
+/-

He's referring to my prediction that Turner will be traded, although it was pure speculation on my part and only based on the rumblings in the sports media that Turner is on the block.

I must admit that this was pretty amusing, even if I haven't been a fan of Turner for a good two years or so.

All-Star Gameday Factoids:

Rondo 3.3 WS/.111 WS48/102 ORtg/102 DRtg/.516 TS% (38g)

Jrue 2.9 WS/.078 WS48/101 ORtg/106 DRtg/.512 TS% (47g)

Kyrie 4.4 WS/.143 WS48/110 ORtg/109 DRtg/.567 TS% (42g)

~~~~

Deron 5.3 WS/.138 WS48/112 ORtg/109 DRtg/.542 TS% (50g)

Brandon 3.7 WS/.094 WS48/104 ORtg/106 DRtg/.499 TS% (51g)

Teague 4.0 WS/.112 WS48/106 ORtg/106 DRtg/.552 TS% (51g)
____

All-Star Gameday Opinion:

Jrue, NBA Turnover Leader (188); 'A-OK' floor general - - Doug's best sales job yet.

You are correct in that the NBA turnover leader is an all star. It's just not Jrue.

Jrue is actually 4th. 1-4 are all All Stars.

Okay, ONLY the Eastern Conference leader by TO total, but the NBA leader by TOPG measure (4.0), and 2nd to 18g "Ferrari" Wall in TOP48 (5.0 to 5.6). Please pardon the blemish on my pass (osmosis).

This much is Jrue: makes some nice plays along the way :)

user-pic
SixersRising on Feb 17 at 14:57
+/-

So if the Sixers had to raise the stakes to get ATL to bite on trading them Josh Smith, would you do:

Thad Young, Spencer Hawes for Josh Smith and Z. Pachulia?

No. I prefer Thad over Josh Smith. Similar player, much better contract. And Thad is younger.

Josh Smith, some highlights-talent but I wouldn't bet on him in the clutch. I'll keep Thad's hustling lead, night in, night out; younger, takes better care of ball, proven good guy/teammate.

Even if you acquire Smith, where's he gonna take ya before he takes the biggest pile of money offered this summer?

The Sixers placed a big wad of cash and a mountain of wishes on Andrew Bynum, Mr. Monday Murmur Doantdu Diddley; thus, the tacit 'quiescence/no stink' agreement between the team and on-the-beat journalists about the extent or quality of the due diligence process prior to the swap, lest the team becomes, perhaps, even more red-faced than current record and fan regard now makes them.

The unknown number of doctors who examined Bynum and gave go-ahead to the organization; the mysterious summer bone bruise development; the solo 'big man moves practice' "ouch"; the surprise autumn Germany injections; the local bowling alley twist; the New York maintenance injections; two painful knees, one painful knee; the six stages of recovery; the team president telling writers to see the public relations dept for latest news... it IS, and HAS BEEN, a fabulous story...

"Long ago in a deep, dark forest there lived a brave bellwether named Howard Eskin... ."


If you can't count on Smith in the clutch then where does that put Young who has consistently disappeared in big games?

Tempting but I wouldn't do it. I just don't see a Bynum/Smith front court having much success offensively. I bet the Sixers would also have to re-sign him to a deal starting at $12 million/year. I'd be more open to this trade if there was a decent PF free agent on the market this summer.

The one thing I like about this trade is that Collins wouldn't be able to give Hawes a 3rd contract.

The word on the street is that the Jazz might trade Milsap for Eric Bledsoe. I've been down on Turner but I still think he's better than Bledsoe. Would you consider a Milsap/Turner swap?

user-pic
Court_visioN reply to Stan on Feb 17 at 19:44
+/-

Yesterday. And I'd definitely consider Eric Bledsoe a better basketball player than Evan Turner

user-pic
Tray reply to Stan on Feb 17 at 20:47
+/-

Too bad no one agrees with you.

user-pic
mymanjrue on Feb 17 at 21:28
+/-

DAMN just missed jrue's dunk

not surprised at all tht pul george is standing out. he IS the player i wish evan turner could be.

evan turner:the poor man's paul george, who was of course on the board when turner was selected

Serendipitously that's the only thing I saw during the game, flipped it on during a commercial in time to see the dunk (and those god awful green shoes, what the hell?)

user-pic
mymanjrue on Feb 17 at 21:30
+/-

wtf is the taco bell commercial with all the comely young women making eyes at a guy with his baby. jesus

user-pic
mymanjrue on Feb 17 at 21:43
+/-

dwight's t-shirt thing is a cry for help

user-pic
mymanjrue on Feb 17 at 21:45
+/-

the problem in l with is that kobe shattered howard's confidence by trying desperately to be as homicidally competitive as jordan, and now he can't put humpty dumpty back together again

user-pic
mymanjrue on Feb 17 at 21:54
+/-

this doctor j oomercial is kind of embarassing. only the part about dunking is not palpably awkward

user-pic
mymanjrue on Feb 17 at 21:59
+/-

david stern and the nba love new york and the knicks so much

user-pic
mymanjrue on Feb 17 at 22:03
+/-

"put your cellphones in the air when we celebrate love, when we celebrate life"

this country has gone to hell

user-pic
mymanjrue reply to mymanjrue on Feb 17 at 22:04
+/-

i'll take false idols for three hundred, alex

that commercial with the guy who gets traded from Harden's posse to Kris Humprhies' posse gets funnier each time I see it:

http://youtu.be/I4BbAwRiy7k

user-pic
Mike reply to das411 on Feb 18 at 10:07
+/-

that actually makes me respect Humphries a little bit for having a sense of humor

Apparently, last night's garish spectacle moved David Stern and retinue deeply. "Marvelous" and "astounding" were responses overheard from his section, more than once.

I thought it was all relatively restrained.

pargo signed for the rest of the year

Interesting piece from Simmons on Jerry Buss today...wonder if he would consider our new owners "old guard, new guard or totally useless"?

http://www.grantland.com/blog/the-triangle/post/_/id/51360/the-lakers-lose-buss-the-nba-loses-a-titan

Not sure they have enough time on the job to be categorized yet though they're headed towards totally useless in my opinion.

I know when people die all their flaws are forgotten, but Buss' inherent misogyny led him to put the wrong child in charge of his franchise, and it's only going to get worse

user-pic
Tray reply to GoSixers on Feb 18 at 16:56
+/-

I don't think the Howard and Nash deals were bad moves at all. There isn't a team in the league that wouldn't make the personnel choices the Lakers did last offseason. Firing Brown and hiring D'Antoni was a mistake, but I think the problem is less coaching than it's Howard's bad back. I know you'll say that Howard's a petulant loser, which he sort of is, but he's always been a much better player than this. Just isn't very mobile right now.

Well since you don't think they were bad moves, they must not have been bad moves.

Howard healthy wouldn't work on this team - he is not of the right make up to work with Kobe Bryant - he's a cry baby

user-pic
Rich reply to GoSixers on Feb 18 at 20:51
+/-

A healthy Howard works on any team, because a healthy Howard pretty much automatically gives you a Top 5 defense. I despise his attitude, and really him as a person, but he's not nearly playing at the level we've seen him at. I wonder if he'll ever get it back.

Nash, on the other hand, never made a ton of sense to me. Him and Kobe's past success relied way too much on dominating the ball. The idea that the Lakers needed a point guard never made a ton of sense because they've always won with bad point guards. And if you're trying to make Nash a spot-up shooter, there's no point in bringing him in. You can get guys who are much cheaper that can make shots and aren't defensive sieves.

And man, hiring D'Antoni has been horrible. They don't even come close to running his system, and that's all he knows.

The problem is the team as a whole is simply put a bad fit. The acquisitions of Nash and Howard weren't bad deals per se, but the resulting core simply isn't a good fit. The mistake was not thinking about it earlier. The Lakers need to make personnel changes IMO and in order to do that, they need to decide what kind of a team they want to be next season. If they want to rebuild around Kobe, they should trade Howard and Nash. If not maybe they should think about allowing Kobe get a title somewhere else.

If not maybe they should think about allowing Kobe get a title somewhere else.

I'm not sure I can see Kobe Bryant riding someone elses coat tails, and what team do you put kobe on that they're better than the heat or thunder (or even spurs) right now?

Kobe's career is rapidly approaching its end, and I for one couldn't be happier.

user-pic
Tray reply to Xsago on Feb 18 at 18:45
+/-

On paper, how are they such a bad fit? The only question mark to me, before the season started, was Nash's age and whether Kobe could play with a ball-dominant point guard. But, one could reason, precisely because Nash was getting so old, he wouldn't be able to orchestrate every possession and probably should be playing off the ball more, which isn't a bad thing given what a great shooter he's always been. Nash and Howard fit really well on paper, and so should Kobe and Howard. Gasol and Howard's more problematic, but Gasol can be used as more of a high-post player, and he and Bynum played reasonably well together. As it turns out, they're a good offensive team that's poor on defense, which according to most analysts is largely attributable to massive degradation in Kobe and Howard's play. But Howard's the octillion-time DPOY, so I didn't really see that coming.

Here are a few reasons, in no particular order:

- Nash is a great player only if he dominates the ball. If he doesn't he becomes a negative on the court, because he is one of the worst defenders in the league. With this system, Nash isn't doing much more than Fisher was. He was a solid shooter and a defensive sieve as well.

- Bryant's and Howard's personalities are so far apart that it affects their on court chemistry. Howard is guy that needs maintenance and Kobe isn't doing his team any favors with half of his public comments. And lets face it Howard is the type of guy whose off court stuff affect his on court performance. He was great in Orlando, because... it was Orlando and not a huge market like LA.

- Nash and Howard were a great fit on paper, because of the success Nash had with Stoudemire. However, in the few times i've seen the Lakers they've never run that kind of a play. And it's all because of Kobe, because that system makes him a spot up shooter most of the time.

- I never said that the problem was realistically on offense. It's on defense, where Nash can't guard anybody, Gasol can't guard athletic and stretch 4s and Kobe is a horrific off the ball defender. Add to it Howards slow return from injury and his head not being in the right place and what you have is a bad defense.

- The terrible defense isn't entirely fixable IMO. It was supposed to be bad anyway, it's hard to imagine Howard alone can make a top 5 defense. The way i thought they will still be able to dominate was by playing a best ever offense (because they have that much talent). And due to poor fits, injuries, terrible coaching and ill-advised comments in the media it hasn't materialized.

Brian, if you ever get sick of looking at yourself may I suggest this as another potentail logo for your site?

http://assets.sbnation.com/assets/2182989/jruedunk.gif

user-pic
Tray reply to das411 on Feb 18 at 23:14
+/-

Kind of sad that that was (a) the 20th or so best dunk of the game, and (b) by far Jrue's best play of the game. Even taken out of context it's kind of blah.

watching live I never thought he was going to be able to dunk it. thought it was a nice dunk and there was actually a defender in the picture, which wasn't the case for about 20 others.

user-pic
MCT reply to Tray on Feb 18 at 23:32
+/-

Jrue's best moment of the game was here (around 1:36):

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XKfK7EjAOSY

Bring on the endorsements / commercials.

I find this terribly hard to believe: "According to the newspaper (Inquirer), the Atlanta Hawks called the Sixers and proposed a trade of Josh Smith for Evan Turner and Spencer Hawes. The Sixers turned it down."

It's been out for a while. It's not that hard to understand if have no interest in resigning Smith and you think Hawes and Turner have some, no matter how small, trade value.

I'd do the trade simply because i view it as the ultimate risk/reward type of trade that is a requirement if you want to build a championship level team, but i honestly wouldn't do it if i don't plan to resign Smith. As bad as Hawes is, and as disappointing Turner has been, there is a market for them IMO.

I find it extremely hard to believe the Hawks would want those two. My feeling is the Sixers would be better off if they made the trade and Smith walked than they would be having those two guys on the books for $13M next season, but I have serious doubts the Sixers were proposed this package and turned it down.

I mean, that package is so bad the Sixers should've just done it last week and flipped Smith this week. There's a much better package out there than those two. Humprhies and Brooks is a better package than those two considering ATL's cap situation.

Humphries has an absolutely horrific contract. And Brooks is an off the bench gunner. I was shocked the Hawks were even discussing that. Smith's value must be extremely low.

Reports are that the Hawks don't think he'll re-sign, and that he won't draw Dwight in. So he has no long term value to the Hawks.

However, making a bad deal that ruins your cap instead of just letting a guy walk and saving the money makes no sense to me in general, but in the NBA, sense seems optoinal


Expand/Contract all comments

Leave a comment


back-to-story.gif