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Scrapping For Every Loss

Even with healthy players the magic have one road win - the sixers should win this one

Good news, I've got the Sixers feed on LP tonight.

This starting five for the Magic might be the shortest I've ever seen.

So your kids never played basketball?:)

Not yet. Very funny.

Turnerbrickbegsforawhistle.

Hey look - don't hate on turner just cause you had a bad day - it's not his fault - remember?

put hollis on afflalo please

Aaaaand we're off...Hawes wins the tip.

Turnerover.

thompson 3

Hollis43.

Late close by Turner, Afflalo hits the three.

sissy 3

Spence43.

Turner cherrypicks a dunk. MCW finds him.

mcw needs to go under on picks more often

Orlando should have started Nicholson and Harkless.

thompson 3

Spence with the big rejection, turner cherry picking again, finds Hollis for the three. Nice.

thad right by davis

Thad really shouldn't settle for any jumpers w/ that slob on him.

bad no rotation by hawes

thompson foot on a line

Foot on the line for Hollis. Should've been a turnerover on the carry.

MCW turnover. ugh.

Magic could sure use Jameer's 4 assists/0 TOs in 11:50 (like in previous match-up and ORL win) right about now.

Heh. Jameer is such trash and you know it.

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Tray reply to Brian on Dec 3 at 19:27
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He's the reason Howard is ringless.

Disagree. Ages 25, 26, 27, 28: .130, .136, .220, .136 WS/48. Mr. Moxie. If he doesn't separate shoulder mid, he'd have earned a Ring. Had been playing exceptionally well.

That was the only year Orlando did anything in the playoffs because he was hurt and they had a better PG filling in for him (Rafer Alston!!!!). He did come back in the Finals for their loss, though. Would've beaten LA if they had stuck with Rafer. His WS #s were high because team defense was amazing w/ Dwight on the floor. Jameer has always been crap.

So is this Turner's thing now? Leaking out on every possession?

If it's on every possession and he's not getting benched you have to think that it's the plan

thad 3!

bad shot lavoy

o-board for lavoy leads to an anderson 3

bad shot hawes

29-34 after one.

Strong defensive effort, as usual.

15 free throws in one quarter - on the road? WTF

down 5 end of the first

Good team to trap against. Make it work.

Sixers' defense is spectacularly bad. all-star game level bad.

the only reason teams score less than 130 ppg against us is they get tired. we wear them out with pace.

stop going over when oladipo is the p/r handler

The crowd is really into it, huh?

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eddies' heady's reply to Brian on Dec 3 at 19:45
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Was just sitting here thinking the same thing. How shameful and pitiful the NBA product has become and how many teams are like these two. Sad sad state of affairs.

et bucket

Disagree. Ages 25, 26, 27, 28: .130, .136, .220, .136 WS/48. Mr. Moxie. If he doesn't separate shoulder mid-year, he'd have earned a Ring. Had been playing exceptionally well.

Dwight: headless horseman.

Saying something wrong twice makes you twice as wrong.

Nah, that's not the right kind of logic, it demonstrates an entire different kind of wrongness and suggests giving up the internet for the sake of everyone

You wish, toadstool.

Support your condemnation, or you're a weasel - again.

nice take by mcw

mcw tip in

sissy 3

Spence43!

Come on Spence, you need to keep this up for 12 more days - you can DOOOOOOOO it

is that when guys who signed in early july can be traded?

any FA agent that signed can be traded i think

That's the date I keep hearing - players signed in the off season can be traded on December 15th. That's when Hinkie gets his swerve on I bet

Doug Collins would've loved coaching Big Baby and Maxielle. Nothing but long twos tonight.

Orton coming in. Has he been in the doghouse?

Thad is letting the threes fly.

They're free.

good trap leads into a mcw bucket

Turner blocked (1 inch of elevation). MCW follows and finishes.

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eddies' heady's on Dec 3 at 20:03
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Heh, Ronnie Price didn't even have to jump to block Turner on a breakaway. Just took it from him down low.

Turner blocked, gets it back, then has it stolen from him (Turnerover).

anderson looks hurt might of banged knees with someone

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eddies' heady's on Dec 3 at 20:07
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Turner falls over the stripe on the side of the lane.

Bailed out by the ref calling a foul while Turner sat on the floor.

MCW airball. MCW brick. Turner trips over himself trying a stupid earthbound move, but they bail him out with a foul call.

Hit the freebies.

I can't begin to describe how much I hate watching this scrub play basketball.

He splits the pair.

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anomiemnemonical reply to Brian on Dec 4 at 9:37
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lol you began to describe it years ago. I agree, lets get Waiters while Cleveland is still shopping him. Like you said before; maybe it's not the optimal return we can get for Turner but it's close enough to it. Not sure what Hinkie is holding out for.

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eddies' heady's on Dec 3 at 20:08
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PLEASE don't give the foul here. You're going to get it back.

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eddies' heady's on Dec 3 at 20:09
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And they give the fucker right away! Why do that?

WHY GIVE THE FUCKING FOUL YOU FUCKING MORONS!!!!!

up 1 at the half

58-57 at the half.

Much better second quarter, could've been even better without the ET sabotage.

brian you are a yankees fan right?

they are close to signing Jacoby Ellsbury to a 7 year deal

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TwoSense reply to sixerfan1220 on Dec 3 at 20:27
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Gardner moving to left?

dont know

7 years, huh? Well, I guess he and McCann will alternate years they miss due to injury.

7 years/$150M. Gardner to left link.

Yeah, I like it. Wonder if Cano would leave for Seattle or take less to stay in NY.

thad tips in his miss

sissy 3!

thad tip in after hawes blows an easy one

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eddies' heady's on Dec 3 at 20:29
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MCW is slowly turning into feast if he's in the paint or famine if he's out of it.

Thad putback.

sissy tip in after thad blows by davis

thad 3!

mcw 3!

Turner rejected by the rim, but fouled. Hit 'em both.

bad turnover by mcw

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eddies' heady's on Dec 3 at 20:46
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MCW throws it to no one, Lavoy not looking.

sloppy turnover by Wroten. Don't give up a hoop here.

up 5 end of the 3rd

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eddies' heady's on Dec 3 at 20:49
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Stupid lazy foul by Davies w/ under a second left.

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eddies' heady's reply to eddies' heady's on Dec 3 at 20:50
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oops maybe not, just a bucket given up from coast to coast in 3.9

That's just sad.

85-80 after three.

They let him catch the ball going toward the hoop, then no one gets in front of him for the layup. Sad.

Wait, was that a shot clock violation? unreal.

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eddies' heady's on Dec 3 at 20:55
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Bad pass by Anderson.

davies is good at fronting the post

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eddies' heady's on Dec 3 at 20:56
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Bad forced pass by Wroten. THey're trying their darnedest to give this lead away.

So is this lineup a tank attempt by Brown?

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eddies' heady's on Dec 3 at 20:56
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ET and MCW back now....

MCW brick. his left is involved.

Turner break after the o-board.

break=brick

et contested jumper goes in

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eddies' heady's on Dec 3 at 21:01
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2 o-boards that possession ends in an Anderson 3.

what is davies doing

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eddies' heady's on Dec 3 at 21:02
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Davies pulls the trigger on a triple. SIT HIS ASS, Brett!

Hoop here = ball game.

Should've been a T on the slob.

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eddies' heady's on Dec 3 at 21:04
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MCW gets his own miss on a missed freebie. Evan offensive foul turnerover.

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eddies' heady's on Dec 3 at 21:05
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MCW got all ball there!!! BS

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eddies' heady's on Dec 3 at 21:06
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Hollis follow!!!

Hollis with the big follow!

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eddies' heady's on Dec 3 at 21:07
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Bad rotations gives it back. ugh

Turner blocked/stripped. Not sure which they'll call it. MCW did the same thing last time down the floor. Picking up bad habits from Turnerover?

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eddies' heady's on Dec 3 at 21:07
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Turnerover running slap dab into Big Baby.

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eddies' heady's on Dec 3 at 21:10
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Turner and-one. He's lucky not turning it over on that one.

Turner stripped, denied penetration by Ronnie Price. Then hits a garbage shot and gets fouled. It's just so fucking hard on the eyes.

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eddies' heady's on Dec 3 at 21:11
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Turner loses Afflalo for a 3.

Turnerover for the offensive foul.

Please get him off Afflalo.

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eddies' heady's on Dec 3 at 21:12
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What was that Thad? ugh

MCW turnover. And Turner's man gives ORL the lead.

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eddies' heady's on Dec 3 at 21:13
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MCW with either the 8th or 9th turnover this quarter.

Afflalo shoots a 3 (now a 2) in Turner's eye

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eddies' heady's on Dec 3 at 21:14
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MCW with either the 8th or 9th turnover this quarter.

Afflalo shoots a 3 (now a 2) in Turner's eye

mcw, wild ass pg. good thing he's tall and cocky and on a crappy team.

Turner to the line. Questionable call imo.

Thad comes up w/ a huge block.

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eddies' heady's on Dec 3 at 21:17
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Thad swats Glen Davis' layup attempt. Shot clock violation.

Nearly a turnerover. Then MCW gets bailed out on a drive. No foul, imo.

MCW just really can't shoot, from anywhere.

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eddies' heady's on Dec 3 at 21:19
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Half court trap, then they gambled like hell for a steal, Finally got it. ET fouled.

Turner splits the pair. Ugh.

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eddies' heady's on Dec 3 at 21:20
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Turner splits the pair.

Is there another SF in the league w/ a 1:1 assist to turnover ratio? (it's actually a hair better, 74 AST, 72 TOV)

First guy that came to mind qualifies, Rudy gay. 37a/54to

MCW follows Turner's hero ball missed slop. That should do it.

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eddies' heady's on Dec 3 at 21:22
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Turner iso?

MCW putback after ET's miss.

mcw tip in!

Afflalo can't miss.

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eddies' heady's on Dec 3 at 21:24
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Thad switches onto Afflalo and he knocks down a 3. One pt game w/ 48 ticks left.

big baby 3?!

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eddies' heady's on Dec 3 at 21:26
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Good play to get Thad the ball in space to operate quickly.

Big Baby 3!!!!????? F me. damn man

Big hoop for Thad. Loved that play, faked the picked, got the ball on a cut on the opposite side of the lane.

Big Baby hits a three to tie it. Timeout. You think this is a Turner iso?

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eddies' heady's on Dec 3 at 21:28
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No way they iso Turner again, no way Brown calls that.

If I'm coaching against the Sixers, I'd hack MCW here. I'd rather have the ball down 1 with the last shot, than defend with this roster.

et misses at the buzzer

off to OT

104-104 after regulation.

Eventually got to a Turner iso. Crappy drive/shot doesn't fall.

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eddies' heady's on Dec 3 at 21:29
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Well, sort of a Turner iso it ended up but not really a true 1-4 iso. Turner misses the 3 footer gimmie. OT.

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eddies' heady's on Dec 3 at 21:31
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MCW floater.

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eddies' heady's on Dec 3 at 21:32
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MCW out of control charge. That had to hurt.

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eddies' heady's on Dec 3 at 21:33
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Turner gets an in-close shot off and makes it.

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eddies' heady's on Dec 3 at 21:36
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Thad lines up a triple and BANG!

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eddies' heady's on Dec 3 at 21:37
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Good cut baseline by Anderson, good find by MCW. Anderson and-one!!

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eddies' heady's on Dec 3 at 21:37
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Ballgame, if they don't give up a 3 on this ORL possession after this timeout.

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eddies' heady's on Dec 3 at 21:39
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Damn, ET fouls Afflalo on a drive. And-one opportunity.

mcw finger roll!

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eddies' heady's on Dec 3 at 21:40
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Carter-Williams scoop shot layup!!

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eddies' heady's on Dec 3 at 21:41
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Oladipo answers.

MCW has to unload a 3 before the buzzer. Short.

Still Sixers ball. Foul on Oladipo, Thad to the line.

Makes both. Up 4, 27 seconds left.

good job by thad to make both fts

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eddies' heady's on Dec 3 at 21:43
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Late whistle there. MCW fouls Oladipo.

Dumb foul.

That's the second time in overtime ORL has missed 2nd FT and the ball has gone out of bounds off us. Ugh.

off mcw

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eddies' heady's on Dec 3 at 21:44
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Victor misses the 2nd freebie, off MCW out of bounds though.

3 pt game w/ 22 left.

ugh evan

Turner fouls Afflalo on a three. That's hilarious.

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eddies' heady's on Dec 3 at 21:46
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Fuck me, ET fouls Afflalo on a step-back 3 pointer. heh

Career high for Turner's man.

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eddies' heady's on Dec 3 at 21:47
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12 seconds to win it. What's the call?

hawes et dribble hand off

This is a Turner iso.

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eddies' heady's on Dec 3 at 21:48
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I'd pull Hawes out high and have MCW drive and kick back to Hawes for a 3 or long two.

Heh. Turner falls down. Jump ball.

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eddies' heady's on Dec 3 at 21:49
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HEH, ET falls down and it's a jumpball. Why didn't he call a TO?

double ot!

118-118 after 5.

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eddies' heady's on Dec 3 at 21:55
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ET pushoff on first possession.

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eddies' heady's reply to eddies' heady's on Dec 3 at 21:55
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terrible call fouls him out.

et fouled out

Turnerover. Think he fouled out on that one. Yup. He won't get a chance to turn it over a 9th time.

MCW to the line.

splits them

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eddies' heady's on Dec 3 at 21:57
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Good ass find MCW. Anderson lay-in.

Nice find by MCW after a blocked shot, rebound.

Jeebus, Spence.

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eddies' heady's on Dec 3 at 21:58
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Spencer sissy fouls Big Baby. He missed the freebie.

Strong board by Spence.

good take by mcw

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eddies' heady's on Dec 3 at 21:59
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MCW take and lefty finish.

MCW to the hoop. Glad he isn't settling for jumpers. Got the stop, have numbers. Baby gives the foul and falls on his gunt.

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eddies' heady's on Dec 3 at 22:00
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They reset the clock and it never hit nothing.

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eddies' heady's on Dec 3 at 22:01
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MCW was trying to get the ball to Thad on the mismatch initially w/ Oladipo on him, but I would rather he have taken Glen Davis as the lane was open for a drive.

What can they do here? Subtract 5 from the shot clock? Call a shot clock violation? I mean, if they hadn't reset it, the Sixers would've hurried to get the shot up in whatever time was left.

3 seconds on the shot clock.

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eddies' heady's on Dec 3 at 22:03
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That's a questionable call, put only 3 on the clock.

Great fucking job by Hollis. That rookie has more sense than Turner. He calls the timeout.

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eddies' heady's on Dec 3 at 22:04
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Hollis scrapping his ass off. Sixers ball after a heady play to call a TO.

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eddies' heady's on Dec 3 at 22:05
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Got to make that Spence. Got to.

Ugh, good passing. Spence missed the baseline J. Need a stop.

Magic ball, Anderson knocked that out. Man, that's three d-boards they had to have they knocked out of bounds.

Wow. Overturned. Now get a hoop.

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eddies' heady's on Dec 3 at 22:06
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That looked to be off ORL. Yep, Sixers ball.

thad bucket

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eddies' heady's on Dec 3 at 22:07
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Thad runner. Dagger?

Nice, Thad.

Triple-double for MCW.

triple double for MCW

great d by thad

Great fucking D by Thad.

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eddies' heady's on Dec 3 at 22:10
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MCW stripped Turner-esque.

Doesn't matter, game over. Sixers gonna win..........

MCWerover.

Afflalo misses a three, Hollis w/ the board and he's fouled. Big Baby fouls out w/ 33 points on about 23 long twos.

Heh. They don't foul, the Sixers turn it over. Hilarious.

ugh anderson

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eddies' heady's on Dec 3 at 22:13
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Wow, Anderson misses both. Not over yet.

This is like two blind guys boxing.

Both teams played hard and should be awarded Ls.

Oladipo also has a triple double.

I do respect that him and MCW take their "rivalry" so serious... as trivial as it may be.

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Statman on Dec 3 at 22:16
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Is it really possible that Evan Turner has no blocks the entire year? He's played 704 minutes now, so he's already in 57th place for most minutes played without a block in the basketball-reference play index era.

Is that true?

Mo Harkless w/ a Willie Green-esque line.

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eddies' heady's on Dec 3 at 22:18
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What the hell is Spencer doing there with the over the back? Stupid silly play. The game's over man.

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eddies' heady's reply to eddies' heady's on Dec 3 at 22:20
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He didn't foul him, but still. Why even come close to the guy like that?

won by 1

126-125 Final.

Sixers win! Yay!

Masterpiece theatre.

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South Broad on Dec 3 at 22:59
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anomiemnemonical reply to South Broad on Dec 4 at 10:00
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"Since a shocking 3-0 start, Evan Turner and the Sixers are 3-12."

wut?

Well it was written before last nights game (I posted it yesterday in the other thread) and which part of it is incorrect?

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anomiemnemonical reply to GoSixers on Dec 4 at 10:13
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oops sorry nvm. I read 3-12 as an overall record.. Losing 12 straight would've been nice though. I'm beginning to worry about these hard-fought multi-OT victory efforts ultimately yielding us a #6 or #7 draft pick. Good article on Hinkie, thanks for sharing.

Yeah - I'm not so worried just yet - 333 ball and the 5th worst point differential, (I think) plus I expect some roster moves in 10 days or so (come on Spence, you can keep it up)

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anomiemnemonical reply to GoSixers on Dec 4 at 11:07
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I don't know. At what point would you start to get worried? I keep hearing these various metrics that suggest how bad the team is but they're only mildly reassuring. Milwaukee is 3-13. So is New York after dropping 9 straight. Utah and Sacramento are 4-15 and 4-12, respectively. How long before Phoenix, Charlotte, and a handful of other teams decide to stop breaking their backs to hover around .500 and try to hit the same lottery we are by making some moves too? I know I shouldn't cherry pick a stat out of the smoking disaster that is the Atlantic at this point, but we're now almost a quarter way through the season and are .5 games back from leading the division. A bottom 2 record guarantees us a top 4 pick, while finishing with just the 5th or 6th worst record or something could easily mean a mid-lotto selection and consequently render this horrid year of "rebuilding" as ultimately fruitless. As much as I can't help but enjoy these OT wins against the Cavs (5-12) and Magic (6-12), I would hate for us (7-12) to lose out to these teams in the long run by winning too much in the short run. Losing a December game = losing one in March. So let's trade some people. I don't wanna wait for the deadline.

I'm not worried yet either. The team is already terrible. They can't lose every game though. Noone can. As long as they are under 16-17 wins before February, they'll get that much needed top 5 pick.

As for other teams, two things stand out to me:

1) Some bad teams like the Knicks and Nets have zero incentives to tank and will inevitably end up better than the Sixers when they get healthier.

2) The Sixers can disintegrate their team via trade easier than any other team. All they need to do is trade one or two of the Hawes/Turner/Thad trio for future assets. Every other team is in a far more difficult position because some need to ship out half their teams, which is impossible. The Sixers are one move away from being historically bad really.

1) Some bad teams like the Knicks and Nets have zero incentives to tank and will inevitably end up better than the Sixers when they get healthier.

Players have zero incentive to tank - period

Meant it in terms of not making tanking roster moves.

Well - there's only so much the knicks (and nets) can do to improve their rosters - they have minimal assets people want to improve their team

But they could make them worse if they wanted to - which is my point and is something other bad teams will do as they approach the trade deadline. They just don't want to, for obvious reasons (New York, stupid GMs, sold picks...).

Ah I see

Yesterday people were talking tanking and the Bucks for instance - Herb Kohl is rather vehemently against it - so maybe they'd have interest in Turner or - the bucks have no outgoing first round picks but have 7 pending second round pick trades through 2019 :). So they have first round picks they can move.

I still believe the sixers roster will have some shake ups between now and Feb 15

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anomiemnemonical reply to Xsago on Dec 4 at 12:29
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Gotcha, I think I knew that actually. I've been reading on here as well as Levin's blog for a couple years almost but never participated in any discussions until just a few days ago. I've lived in the states most of my life but was born in St. Petersburg in Russia and lived there as a kid so I was just curious.

To your point though: I totally agree with you that Philly is terrible - who can argue that? But the difference between being the most or second most terrible and being the 5th or 6th most terrible team could prove to be franchise-altering, particularly this year with this draft pool. Boston can move Rondo, maybe Green too. Phoenix could be more than willing to fix their overachieving roster by flipping Morris or Dragic (we already know that they were just as set on tanking when this year started as the Sixers were). Maybe Chicago has a firesale now that Rose and his career has wilted along with their post-season aspirations.

Who knows. Suppose they do that Turner for Dion Waiters swap and Waiters comes in, proves to be a nice fit in Brown's offense, and clicks with MCW like they used to back in Syracuse. Waiters has had 0 chemistry with anybody on his team that's of any importance and could very plausibly emerge as an okay player who could keep us on par with our performance up to this point. He's a Philadelphia guy and is certainly more gifted than Turner.. who is just painfully unathletic while acting as the centerpiece of our offense with a skill set and ability that are clearly those of a complimentary role player i.e. 4th option on a serious NBA team. Just one example of waiting for the deadline to make a trade and it all going wrong.

Or maybe Hawes + our second rounders to OKC for any two of Perry Jones, Adams, or Lamb. Or the same thing but with just Thad. Another two scenarios I wouldn't be opposed to but that could turn out to be a non-factor on our W-L record if one of the return pieces happens to emerge. I mean let's not pretend that Evan Turner is like some really hard act to follow right?

Anyway sorry for writing a novel but I guess I'm saying that too many teams out there can very realistically finish below us and accumulating pointless wins with this group early on could spell that very difference. The trades need to happen now so we still have some room to maneuver before the deadline in case we're still winning too much after trading Turner, Thad, or Spencer. The difference between picking top 3 and outside of the top 5 is usually only a half dozen wins yet come June 26th, it could mean the difference between Andrew Wiggins and Rodney Hood - the player that nbadraft is currently mocking to us at 7 if the season were to end today.

I agree with pretty much all of this. Early season wins wind up killing you when you're tanking. My fear was they'd be around .500 at the 20-game mark, they're too close to that for me right now. I think they've been extra cautious with injuries (holding out MCW and Hawes, plus the Thad situation), and that isn't getting the job done. They need to make moves, and the return can't improve them in the short term. Trades returning draft picks, or maybe even returning an injured player, would be ideal.

Oh, and welcome to the discussion.

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anomiemnemonical reply to Brian on Dec 4 at 13:05
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Thanks

Well i guess i kinda disagree on a couple of things:

- I think you underestimate the impact Hawes has had on winning so far. Just scratch him and this is a 2-3 win team. And i don't think replacing him with young players such as the OKC ones will result in immediate success.
- I think Hinkie wants to trade those guys for future value, not current value. He wants picks, not capable players. And when they get traded for picks, you are left with lineups like Wroten/Williams/Thompson/Davies/Orton logging heavy minutes. That's the worst regular rotation lineup in the NBA and pretty much no team can beat it.

Lets use your examples:
- Do you think Boston minus Green would lose a lot more than it does now? Rondo hasn't played yet so he doesn't matter.
- Do you think trading Dragic would make the Suns much worse? They'd be worse but they were winning without him as well and have been much better than the Sixers overall.

My point is the Sixers are more or less 6-7 players deep. Every other team in the league is at least 12-13 players deep. Scratch 2 players, you are looking at 4-5 NBA rotation players compared to 10 NBA rotation players.

But opponents keep sitting their best players against the Sixers, so it changes the calculus.

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anomiemnemonical reply to Xsago on Dec 5 at 11:37
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I don't think I'm undervaluing Spencer's contributions..best player on the team thus far and would command 25+ minutes in any NBA rotation, based on the first quarter of this season at least (this isn't the real Spence though unfortunately). My argument wasn't about Hawes' impact being negligible or anything like that, in fact the opposite. The problem is that when Hawes gets traded, these early and mid-season wins he's notching for us now won't be leaving with him. Same with Thad and ET and whatever they end up being good for this season.

I wish there really was an option where we could just "scratch him [Hawes]" and poof - half of our wins vanish, but whatever damage being done to our tanking record now is permanent; no matter how furious Hinkie's epic emergency demolition effort will be come deadline. The stolen W's can't be shipped off to Cleveland, only the culprits maybe.

I'm worried that Hinkie will find himself behind the 8-ball on Feb. 20 at the deadline. We could very well be sitting ahead of a half-dozen other crap teams - all of them shutting down players and trading away anything resembling quality. So same as our plan except from the crucial inside position of 'worse record'. And why..? Because for once in their careers Hawes and Turner teamed up to win a few games (like never) and as a result f'd up our entire season (like always).

Normally a team tends to wait until the deadline to make significant moves since the reward for a conservative strategy like that = better quantity and quality of trade options, more trade partners, more time to evaluate and pinpoint needs, etc.

But since everything with this Sixers season is antithetical and upside-down, going with this traditional strategy of patience = a lose/lose proposition. Either Spence and Turner eventually come down to Earth and lose trade value or they keep up with this contract-year-breakout bullshit and get us pick #8. Therefore, each passing day that Hinkie doesn't make a move is a step toward one of those two destinations.

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anomiemnemonical reply to Xsago on Dec 6 at 14:18
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Hinkie may want draft picks but nobody is going to give up anything close to lottery-tier selections for the 3 guys we're theoretically shopping. So either you're taking back something in the late-1st range for Spence, Thad, & Turner or you have to be open to going after some young draftees from the past couple of years, at least if you want a more fair return for your players.

As for my Boston/Phoenix trade examples, that wasn't meant as anything concrete. Just throwing out a couple names off the top of my head as a way of saying other tanking teams can also unload their top-producing players just like the Sixers can in order to stay below us in the standings.

"My point is the Sixers are more or less 6-7 players deep. Every other team in the league is at least 12-13 players deep."

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anomiemnemonical reply to anomiemnemonical on Dec 6 at 14:24
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"My point is the Sixers are more or less 6-7 players deep. Every other team in the league is at least 12-13 players deep."

Not really, 9 maybe 10 players deep but on most teams 10, 11, 12 aren't exactly 'depth' - they're garbage time guys - injury insurance - they're not rotational

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anomiemnemonical reply to GoSixers on Dec 6 at 14:34
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Ughhh I keep trying to reply to this quote basically with what you just said there lol. Xsago said this above and when I try copy pasting it along with my reply after it, only the quoted part from Xsago shows up. 3 times now

Hey, glad to see here another person with some Russian connections. I've been reading this blog for a long time but almost never write anything too. It would be interesting to chat with you a bit if you don't mind. Do you still speak russian btw? You could hit me up via email which is in my profile.
Sorry for offtop. As for the Sixers, I really glad that the franchise finally has a real plan for the future with this new management group. Seems like they are really want to build something special here. Finally there is some light on the horizon. So even there are some ugly losses I could say I enjoy this season very much. Thanks for you blog, Brian. I hope in some time you can even change the name of it for something more optimistic ;)

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anomiemnemonical reply to Alex`D on Dec 6 at 14:50
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Privet, da ya govoryu po Russki. Tolko y menya zapas slov ochen' primitivnyi :)

I still speak Russian but I don't have a Cyrillic keyboard. Plus my Russian vocabulary is on par with about a 3rd grader. only practice I get is with my mom on the phone and we never discuss basketball or anything political lol so I might struggle a bit chatting about those subjects in Russian. Do you live in Russia yourself? And if so, where?

Yes, I live in Russia. City called Samara. Do you live in Philadelphia? How did you become a Sixers fan?

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anomiemnemonical reply to Alex`D on Dec 7 at 16:55
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http://m.youtube.com/watch?feature=youtu.be&v=grXws5m11SA&desktop_uri=%2Fwatch%3Fv%3DgrXws5m11SA%26feature%3Dyoutu.be

Iverson I guess. I started following basketball in 2001 around the post-season time and he had a pretty captivating performance during those playoffs that made a lot of kids my age into fans of his.

How about you?

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anomiemnemonical reply to GoSixers on Dec 4 at 12:38
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He never said anything about the players personally taking on the tanking efforts. Just that the management and ownership groups of the two NYC teams have nothing to tank for this year and have some key players sitting out.

Well, I don't know that i'm "worried" either way - but Bill King needs to save his job - so a shake up (bye kidd) wouldn't be surprising - not sure the knicks can get better - but chandler is coming back at some point right?

It's all up in the air, players don't tank - so until the the 15th and december (and then the trade deadline) you can't be sure of much.

If the first three games of the season are played over (with those teams being healthy) the sixers being 1-2 wouldn't be a shocker to anyone - and then they'd only have 5 wins and 14 losses and look a lot worse to many folks. The first 3 games were a 'mirage' I think. They're a 333 team at best (translates to a 27 win season) at this time - and I think roster shake ups are coming

PS - yes they won last night, but

1. Double Overtime
2. At Home
3. Against a team with one road win
4. Missing two key players

Plus two not great guys had career nights

Sure they 'won' last night but if you are pro tanking you gotta look at last night as a 'moral' loss cause honestly - it shouldn't have been that close

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anomiemnemonical reply to anomiemnemonical on Dec 4 at 10:11
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oops sorry nvm. I read 3-12 as an overall record.. Losing 12 straight would've been nice though. I'm beginning to worry about these hard-fought multi-OT victory efforts ultimately yielding us a #6 or #7 draft pick. Good article on Hinkie, thanks for sharing.

Chuck Hayes on his teammate Demarcus Cousins:

Even Kings minority partner Shaquille O'Neal, who went through a similar learning curve with the officials, supposedly swings by once a month to impart some wisdom, although veteran Chuck Hayes rolled his eyes at O'Neal's assertion that he and Cousins are alike. "I don't think there's a similarity in the two at all," Hayes said. "In game, personality or character."

As far as I'm concerned, that's a compliment for Cousins

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Rich reply to Tray on Dec 4 at 21:52
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I think their character and personalities are somewhat similar, though Cousins conveys it poorly in the all-important areas where Shaq largely handled it well.

Speaking of Cousins, it cracks me up that a pint sized guard on his team, that currently makes 1/15th of what he'll make next year, is clearly a better offensive player than him. Even acknowledging that Thomas is due for a pretty hefty raise next year, it's still pretty funny.

Fun stat.

MCW and Oladipo are 2 of only 14 players who have had a 25p/10a/10r game as a rookie. Link.

That’s a pretty good company to be in. It’s funny, but Griffin has done it twice :)

That goes up to 24 players if you put the filter at under 22. Lebron has like a dozen such games. Still pretty good company though. Link

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anomiemnemonical reply to Xsago on Dec 4 at 11:11
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Hey where in Europe do you live?

Macedonia. Are you from Europe as well?

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anomiemnemonical reply to Xsago on Dec 4 at 13:43
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Sorry I replied to your question a little further up on the thread - where we were talking about the Sixers and if they suck enough or need to suck more, it's in the opening part of the essay I wrote up there, but yeah I'm Russian and moved to the U.S. when I was 10.

One of my frat guys at school was born in Croatia. He left when he was 4 and his dad talked my ear off once about how they stayed in Skopje as refugees for a few months and how much they loved it there after being stuck in Sarajevo during the siege for over a year lol.

Read that comment don't worry.

Those were difficult times indeed. Things have changed quite a bit in the region since then though. I currently live in Skopje btw :)

P.S. You would love to see Karasev on the Sixers wouldn't you?

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anomiemnemonical reply to Xsago on Dec 4 at 15:17
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Yeah I wanted to add something about how I think the reason for moving was that my mom probably thought that whole 1990's wild west circus they had going on up there would last forever but then remembered Macedonia's 90's adventures and just deleted it. Didn't want it to sound like someone complaining about a bee sting to someone who just survived a bear attack.

You're old enough to remember the Balkan and Kosovo craziness I take it? I was born in 1990 but some of my first memories were of how everything on Russian TV channels was endless news coverage of the Balkan Peninsula conflicts and their aftermath. Just looping 24/7 discussion of why Bill Clinton and Wes Clark are assholes lol. What's the point of Sesame Street when you can learn about how the US/UK/Israeli alliance is carpet bombing Serbia via a NATO ruse right when Russia is in its darkest historical hour and facing its own existential crisis, right? :) We need quality childhood programming like that on TV here.

I know it's still kind of a national tragedy in Russia and sort of a collective guilt type of thing that the whole mess happened at the most inopportune time and that the Russians couldn't do anything to help Serbia militarily.
I guess the Macedonians were pretty much the only ones who managed to secede in a relatively civil manner, though I'm sure the half-million Albanian refugees were probably tough to deal with for such a small country. I've been reading and streaming some Russian radio and hear that some of them now want to 'Kosovo-off' the piece of Macedonia where their population is mainly concentrated. Really hope there's no 90's repeat in the future.

Yeah i was young back than too, but i remember it of course. The whole situation (with the bombing on Serbia in the center of it) was a mess and will really remain as THE dark spot on the resume for NATO and the US. I just hope they learned something from their mistakes and i do think there is a better balance of forces in the world these days, which is much needed but it's still far from great. We only had a relatively small military conflict in Macedonia, but there are still consequences that will never go away.

I think the biggest problem the entire time was that the western media poorly handled the whole situation. The narrative was politically motivated instead of telling the actual truth.

And in the end instead of fixing the problem and creating what they said was a chance for people from different cultures and nationalities to live together, there's more nationalism in the Balkan's now than there was in the 70s, 80s and early 90s.

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anomiemnemonical reply to Xsago on Dec 4 at 15:41
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Oh yeah, Sixers: I don't get super nationalistic when it comes to non-Olympic sports but I guess I wouldn't mind Karasev. You know way more about his game than I do based on reading some of your posts here and on LB in the past. About 3, 4 years ago I've read stuff where Alex Shved was projected as some Russian Allen Iverson type of stand-out, then he hit quality Euro competition so that talk faded. Now he gets cannibalized on defense in the NBA and nothing about his handle, shot creation, and playmaking looks so special.

I know Karasev can shoot and is from Saint Petersburg, that's about it. On second thought, he might feel right at home playing in Philadelphia, being from St.P. Cold, dark, rainy Northern city with a morbidly negative culture & people plus some chart-topping murder statistics. All against a grandiose architectural and historical backdrop.

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The Six on Dec 4 at 12:19
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Do I understand correctly that the Sixers are owed 2014 second rd picks from both the Bucks and Nets? If so, those are looking pretty good.

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The Six reply to GoSixers on Dec 4 at 12:28
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Interesting language in those second rd picks that we owe.....

The first round obligation - I don't like it - if things go the 'right' way they'll be without first round picks in 2015 and 2017 unless they obtain someone else's

you think they are making the playoffs in 2015?

Well - Noel will be healthy - a year under their belt for MCW - two more rookies from the lottery - and oh yeah - how are the knicks nets or raptors getting better?

I'm not saying they'll be good - but it's possible that the sixers are currently (even likely) in the worst division in basketball - and the knicks are going to over pay Carmelo - the nets are in cap hell and the raptors - well - i mean sure they have their new GM but they aren't well positioned just yet.

So yes, at this point, I know it's a long way off, but I could see the sixers winning the atlantic division next year - with a barely 500 record

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Stan reply to GoSixers on Dec 4 at 13:31
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I expect the Knicks and the Nets to get better if/when Chandler and Deron come back healthy. I can see Boston making the playoffs with Rondo, Jeff Green, Avery Bradley, their lottery pick, Atlanta's 1st round pick, and whatever they're going to do with their cap space. Maybe Toronto gets better if Jonas and Terrence Ross can have breakout years.

Philly could be 1st or last in their division and I wouldn't be surprised either way.

I don't think this is a major issue. The key is establishing the core of the team and the hope is that some of MCW, Noel and the 2014 picks will prove to be enough to have at least 2 of the top 3-4 players on a potential contender in pace. The rest can be done in free agency - which should be easier to do when you have stars already on the team.

brooklyn and Houston

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Statman on Dec 4 at 16:12
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Regarding the tanking discussion, I think the biggest "threat" for the Sixers' tanking chances is that they will accidentally win the Atlantic Division, which is probably in the conversation for the worst division in pro sports history. How would you like to be the Celtics, on pace for 32 wins and the 10th worst record in the league, who would right now "miss" the lottery as the Atlantic Division champ and #4 seed in the East?
(And the Sixers are only a half game behind the Celtics.)
The East as a whole is ridiculous, with .500 Washington the 3rd seed.

By way of comparison, the 2010 NFC West, in which every team was under .500, finished with a collective 25-39 record (.390 aggregate). This year's Atlantic is currently at .322 together, an average of 26-56 over a whole season.

well in terms of awful races this one would have been fun to see go the whole season: http://www.baseballrace.com/races/MLB-1994-AL_West-Normal.asp

That reminds me of the sql query i built once that allowed the daily standings to be printed out for an entire season - was tons of fun to figure out

Seriously - from a tank point of view - the sixers have no luck - MKC couldn't wait a week to break his hand?

BTW - when's the ice capades trip start? I expect that to be a train wreck

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Tray reply to GoSixers on Dec 4 at 19:08
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MKG mostly just gives you defense. What will happen if he's out; will Turner go off for a huge game? I think we can still lose.

they have a 6 game road trip from December 21st to January 4th but the first game is on the 21st then they dont play til the 28th

So - they have a 15 day road trip - they play six games - but FIVE OF THEM are played in 8 days.

Jesus the NBA schedule is SO STUPID - you've got irritating back to backs and then a week without a game - seriously - a drunk monkey could schedule better than that

Why would you schedule a regular season NBA game in Mexico? I'm shocked SHOCKED I tell you that some sort of equipment disaster might delay/cancel the game.

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eddies' heady's on Dec 4 at 21:20
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Did someone mention above that Rodney Hood is mocked to us at #7? Tray says that's "ridiculous" with the Martell Webster wannabe. I mean, this is the guy that was ranked in the 60's as a 2nd rounder on Draft Express right? What in the world has happened? Mocked #7? Say it ain't so....

Assuming everyone who is expected to declares for the draft, Hood wouldn't even be in the discussion at 7 for me. He's obviously way better than the 60s though.

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Rusty reply to Rich on Dec 4 at 22:23
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Yes, a lot of disparity in the mocks early on but I would not expect Hood to be in the conversation at number 7.

Honestly I have made it a point to watch a lot of college basketball this year and will continue to do so. Rodney Hood has a nice stroke, and seems to be a good offensive player overall. He benefits from focus on Parker in my opinion. I can't get a good read on his defense but wasn't overly impressed. I think he can be an asset in the right offense which has spacing and gets him space for open looks.

I am just curious as who will qualify as a "Hinkie" guy. It is clear he likes length and athleticism but he also has a huge penchant for heart.

I want to see more of this Lavine kid from UCLA. Stats look quite impressive.

I thought the "experts" were leaning towards having a group of 7 potential superstars (Parker, Randle, Wiggins, Exum, Gordon, Embiid, Smart) with a big drop off after that. How did Hood crack that top 7? Did they assume someone won't declare (which is possible of course). He could be a mid first round pick though...

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sfw reply to Xsago on Dec 5 at 7:06
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They have gordon in the teens. Arizona has a ton of talent and he seems to be playing a smaller role offensively for them. Difficult to gauge his offensive skills in the 1/2 court.

Didn't you say that this team was way too good to tank and Hinkie was clearly not trying to tank? I believe what I said was ridiculous was your claim that he was a top 5 player in the draft. Still is ridiculous. He has played really well though.

Doolittle has a piece up on tanker trades. Hawes to OKC for Perkins, PJIII and a protected 1st rounder.

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Tray reply to Brian on Dec 5 at 1:43
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I was going to say that I would like to do a little better than that and get a prospect who's actually shown flashes of being good, but apparently Jones has looked really good in his brief minutes this season.

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anomiemnemonical reply to Tray on Dec 6 at 14:14
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If I recall correctly, Perry Jones has a serious degenerative knee condition which came to light when all the NBA team doctors did their medical evaluations on everyone before the 2012 draft. That's the only reason OKC was able to get him - he was a top 8 lock before the med reports came out saying his NBA future is capped at age 30 or so.

I wouldn't do that trade unless it's Adams or Lamb instead of PJ. Or if they take the protection off the draft pick. But no way Presti does any of that. They need Adams if Perk is moved and they're really counting on Lamb for his shooting as early as now so he isn't a prospect anymore

I probably wouldn't do it. PJIII is a fringe prospect at this point and a late first rounder has minimal value to a team that has no financial issues and is looking for a superstar. Also, i'm not taking Perkins contract without being compensated with a pick just for the salary relief. So if that pick is for taking on Perkins, Hawes for PJIII makes no sense IMO...

According to the article Perkins can have his salary 'flexed' after he is waived.

Yet again, you're over valuing Spencer Hawes and his expiring contract

I'm not really overvaluing him. I'd rather let him go and have the cap space instead of taking on Perkins. Cap space is important in the new CBA. You can get a lot of good players on decent deals if you are smart. And i believe in Hinkie managing the cap room. He won't just overpay a mediocre player. Also i feel like you can get at least a late first round pick with that cap space in the summer too, like Utah did last year.

And the "stretch" provision would produce more harm than good to the Sixers. It's even more important to have a clean salary slate in 2015.

Would you do that trade?

Yes I'd do the trade, and anyone who thinks they'll do better is deluding themselves.

No crap team is going to take on the sixers expiring contracts, so dreaming of high first round picks is nuts.

Oh yeah, stretching perkins makes him cost 3.2 million dollars over the three seasons after this one.

3.2 million ain't much and maybe Jones pans out, maybe he doesn't - but a not so bad salary when the team is flush in cap space, a first round pick in the mid 20s or so and an upside talent are a pretty good deal for a guy who has shown about 25 games of improvement in relation to the rest of his career...

Also i feel like you can get at least a late first round pick with that cap space in the summer too, like Utah did last year.

That depends on a lot of variables - for instance, Golden State needed the cap room to sign free agents last year - this year is not as good a free agent year as last year cause really Lebron ain't going anywhere and SAS aside - Carmelo isn't taking less money to go somewhere else - he cares about his money.

You are over valuing spencer hawes who before this season no one would have offered even that much for him - it's a small sample size and odds are he'll still regress to the mean - that's a deal you can make today before Spencer starts to regress...

Spencer Hawes is a defensively soft 7 footer who seems to have discovered a 3 pointer this season (under 20 games by the way) playing on a team and has an expiring contract - his long term value to most teams is pretty low - he's a short term rental...take what you can get

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Tray reply to GoSixers on Dec 5 at 11:11
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"Yes I'd do the trade, and anyone who thinks they'll do better is deluding themselves."

They might do better than Perry Jones. Last year the Magic got Tobias Harris for Redick, who was expiring. Redick had more of a track record of being an actually good NBA player than Hawes does, but he still was just a role player on a bad team. Hawes has been pretty great this year and I think some teams have always overrated his talents, long before he was even playing well.

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Tray reply to Tray on Dec 5 at 11:14
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Also, note that teams on the bubble of making the playoffs make moves just to make the playoffs, sometimes. Not that I think they'd give us a pick in this year's draft, but is Cleveland crazy enough to give us a 2015 first-round pick for Turner? Maybe.

Here's an idea

What do you have that is better.

Keep in mind trading Spencer Hawes is not just about obtaining assets - but since so far this year he is the sixers best over all player - he is one of the primary victims in the 'hurting' of the tanking procedure.

Can't keep him

Evan Turner

Scoring More

Doing everything else less

Except for turnovers

free throws are up

Ah yes his free throw attempts are up (but that's scoring isn't it?)
Assist Rate Down
Turnover Rate Up
Rebounding Rate basically flat
Scoring is up
3 point percentage is pathetic (though a career high in attempts per game)
foul rate is up
defensive suckness is up

So he's scoring a lot of points and improved upon little else

its scoring but its good scoring and not based on long 2's that arent sustainable

Don't know that his FT rate is sustainable - don't know where to look at free throw rates

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Tray reply to GoSixers on Dec 5 at 12:34
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His FT rate is .319 FTA/FGA this year, up from .198 last. Per basketball reference. That's probably on nba's stats too. And you can find lovely shot charts and shot distribution charts there as well.

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Tray reply to GoSixers on Dec 5 at 12:29
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His TS% has jumped from .478, a level at which he was possibly headed out of the league, to .544, which is okay-to-decent for his position. Better than Deng, Kawhi, Lance Stephenson, DeRozan, Mayo, Eric Gordon, Melo, Beal, every guard on this team plus Thad, and all sorts of fairly well-regarded players who don't play his position, like Jeff Teague, Aldridge, Jrue, Marc Gasol, Wall, Al Jefferson. So it's not at all accurate to say that his scoring is just up, like the only change is that he's taking more shots or something. Of course, I don't like him and would also happily trade him, but he has some value and has improved his game rather dramatically. 40% of his shot attempts are in the restricted area this year, 30% last season. And the long twos are down from 25% to 15% of his shots. And for whatever reason he's a much more efficient finisher this year. And finally, he's getting to the line at a higher rate, not just more often as he takes more shots.

@ChrisVito Michael Carter-Williams said he hasn't even tried running on swollen knee. Got treatment. He will travel with team to Charlotte.

When did his knee get swollen?

sometime during the double OT game


“[Doug Collins] would say, ‘I don’t want you taking any threes,’” Young explained to CSNPhilly.com this week. “As opposed to Coach Brett [Brown] coming in and saying, ‘I want you to step back and take threes. It makes no sense to take a long two.’”

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Tray reply to GoSixers on Dec 5 at 14:54
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Why is a tanking team going out of its way to play a wins-maximizing strategy, one which isn't really needed for player development? The players we're trying so hard to change are players we're likely trading, or not re-signing. And even if we don't trade Thad, did we need to hone his three-point shot this year, or Hawes's? Couldn't that just be done in practice? Is this just done for trade value? It's not just the coach, Hinkie's said that cutting down on long twos is an organizational mandate of his. We'd be just as bad as Utah or anyone if Collins was still the coach, or if we were still employing his offensive philosophy.

First of all, i think people have gone a little overboard with all this "offensive improvement". I'm not sure anyone realizes that the Sixers are actually worse this year offensively than they were last year. I'm not saying last year's strategy was better, far from it, just that the offensive improvement has been more in philosophy than actual on court impact. And isn't that exactly what we want?

Also, i think establishing the right way to play is very important going forward. Losing should come as a result of not having good enough personnel to execute the scheme, not because the team is using a flawed scheme.

And last but not least, i don't think Hinkie is set on who stays and who goes. He never was. He's evaluating everyone and everyone's available in trades for the right price. He's giving everyone a chance to show what they have and how they might fit within the schemes the team will use in the future. Nothing wrong with that. It's the right way to do it.

HOw are you judging offensive improvement after 20 games and saying that aren't as good as last year - or is it just your perception that they're not as good?

Better offensive philosophy, worse results.

2012-2013 Ortg (points per 100 possessions): 102.0
2013-2014 Ortg (points per 100 possessions): 101.2

The numbers are from basketball-reference.com

They look like they are better due to the much higher pace and the high point totals, but their offense overall hasn't exactly been better. The bench especially has been pathetic offensively.

An insignificant difference that might adjust up or down - if I were someone whining about last year versus this year i'd look at the defensive rating through 20 games which is 2 points below at this point.

Then again, these are to be expected as well (much like the down ward trend of the various team statistics)

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Tray reply to Xsago on Dec 6 at 1:52
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Yeah, our offense is worse than last year's because we've got less talent. We used to have an All-Star point guard and now we have a (hopefully) future All-Star point guard who can't make shots. So between improved shot selection and decreased talent, we've gotten a little worse. But we need to be a lot worse. There's a lot of competition for the top three spots in the lottery, and while we can blow up our team with greater ease than some other teams if we have to, we have a lot of wins in the bag thanks to our improved philosophy that can't be undone. I'm not, you know, predicting with any certainty that we won't get a top 3 pick or even that we won't have the worst record in the league by the end of the season; obviously there are very plausible scenarios where we out-tank everyone. But it does worry me that we're playing more or less strategically optimal offense, and I find it puzzling that a team whose roster seemed designed to win the lottery is simultaneously trying to wring as many wins out of that roster as possible. To put this in concrete terms, suppose we were Jazz fans instead of Sixers fans. Would we be better off with a smart coach like Brown who could use and develop Favors and Kanter and Burke and Burks and Hayward intelligently and potentially cause the team to pick 4th or 5th instead of 1st, or would we be better off enduring the awful season they are now with Corbin? I think this lost season will be worth it if they get Wiggins, and they're a team that actually has lots of young players that are staying with the team for a while and need to be developed correctly. We have just one, really.

Ok, so i have several thoughts on this:

1. The team hasn't been anywhere near as good as their record so far. Point differential says otherwise. And those kind of things tend to average out over the course of the season. They are bound to lose some close games later in the season.

2. They are 4-12 over the last 16 games. That's 25% winning percentage. And they are even worse than that considering the only 2 games they've won recently are double overtime games. They've played 11 home games to just 8 road games. Even if they keep winning at that 25% rate (which is their upper limit IMO) they'll end up with 22-23 wins in the end. And my theory is that as long as they have less than 22-23 wins by the end of the season, they'll get that needed top 4-5 pick almost regardless of lottery luck (if you end up with a bottom 4 record it's extremely unlikely you'll end up out of the top 5). And you are not going to end up with less than a bottom 4 record with 22-23 wins. Bottom 4 records in recent years:
- 2013: 20,21,24,25
- 2012: 7,20,21,21 (out of 66) which translates to 9,25,26,26 in a full season
- 2011: 17,19,22,23
- 2010: 12,15,25,26
- 2009: 17,19,19,23
- 2008: 15,20,22,22

And i think this year with so many teams tanking it's reasonable to expect that noone will be able to go under 20 wins (maybe 1 western team but that's it). Someone has to win those games between all those teams.

Don't get me wrong i do think these wins are technically bad myself but i they are a representation of one of the worst teams in the league. Terrible teams do win some games every once in a while and have "hot" stretches. All of this panic is because that "hot" stretch for the Sixers came in the first week of the season.

3. I know this is contrary to popular belief, but I don't think improved offensive philosophy is the biggest reason why they've won more games than expected. There are two main reasons IMO:
- They are in a better physical condition than anyone in the league and their fitness level helps them play well in the 4th quarter and overtime (they are actually outscoring opponents in these periods)
- MCW is much better than anyone thought (which sort of makes the expectations wrong)

I think they'll lose the fitness advantage over the course of the year. We'll see.

4. As for the Jazz i think they'd be far better off with Brown. Any team would be in reality, it's the GM job to take care of the tanking, but this holds especially true for the Jazz. They already have plenty of talent on board that needs to be properly developed and turned into a contender IMO. They don't really need a top pick this year. But they will need it if Corbin continues to screw up their development. They are not completely ruined yet, but if this continues to the end of the season, i'm not sure all of them will be salvageable.

Btw, Utah has improved quite a bit as soon as their own rookie PG Trey Burke returned from injury. They are nowhere near as bad as they used to be (3-3 since) with some quality wins and not an easy schedule.

All that said forget about Utah drafting Wiggins. I think Utah is destined to land Jabari Parker. With the mormon connection Parker would have the same appeal in Utah that Lebron had in Cleveland and Rose has in Chicago. They would pick him at any position if he's on the board when they draft.

P.S. Sorry for the very long post.

Btw my picks for worst teams in the league by the end of the season:

1. Sacramento
2. Philadephia
3. Utah
4. Milwaukee
5. Orlando / Cleveland

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anomiemnemonical reply to Xsago on Dec 6 at 12:57
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I think Cleveland and Chicago took Lebron and Rose for non-geographical reasons.

I remember how during the 2010 draft Gordon Hayward was destined to be an Indiana Pacer. Mild-mannered white kid from Indianapolis combined with that whole feel-good hometown hero narrative thanks to Butler's Cinderella tournament run. Plus the Pacers were sitting at 10 looking for a wing who could shoot.

Then Utah took him at 9 and the Pacers settled for Paul George

I really love the idea of tanking for a great draft pick and potential star, while simultaneously developing young guys and fringe player type castaway dudes, all the while showcasing a few vets in order to trade them away for the future. I'm on board!!

But be honest - did you jump out of your seat when Hawes hit that fall-away corner 3? How about when MCW was the clear top dog on the floor in Game 1 against the Lebrons?

At the end of the season I hope the Sixers are in the best possible position with the draft and all the dead wood has been moved, but goddamn, it's FUCKING IMPOSSIBLE for me to root against these guys. Sorry about the language.

No doubt they are more likeable and watchable then they have been for a while. Even the annoying players like ET and Hawes are much less annoying now that coach Brown has them playing to their strengths.

That said, I'm finding myself in games hoping they get some unlucky breaks resulting in close losses. A close loss the other night in Orlando would have been perfect. The respectable outing against the Pacers was very enjoyable. I laugh when Hawes wins a game with an off balance 3, but I would have been happy to see him miss that shot too.

MCW didnt make the trip to Charlotte and will not play tomorrow

Cripes

Evan Turner will take 30 shots - over under?

under i hope

Turner has always come up extremely small when someone else is injured and he's "needed" to play a bigger role. Going all the way back to when Iguodala was hurt.

I didn't say he was going to come up big - I just said he was going to take more shots :)

Though - I think it's wroten the back up right? He likes to shoot a lot

Hyphen missing 5 of first 20 games is a question mark. Is he soft or is braintrust keeping him in the barn?

playing it safe

In the tank.

How many games did he miss while at Syracuse?

0 i think

Yeah I guess soft

Maybe, maybe not at this point relative to NBA rigors. Early returns on durability, not good. First a foot, now a knee. (No need to "enlighten" as to small sample size.) Averaged 25 mpg in 66 career Syracuse games ... a little short of iron man label.

Gather ye opening taps while ye may/Old time is still a-flying - Bird Averitt

35 MPG his sophomore year(he barley played his freshman year)

36 MPG on one of the fastest pace teams in the league

rarely*

I admire your tenacity - explaining the reasons to hold a guy out who is your future when your present is going nowhere - to make sure he's 100% and not risk long term injury - discretion being the better part of valor - these are complicated ideas

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Tray reply to GoSixers on Dec 6 at 11:33
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broken - English

Lawyer - useless

argument - pointless

Bravo!

Cortland State, Binghamton and Rochester Institute of Technology.

some East PGs at quarter turn:

minutes played ppg/apg TS% USG% WS/48

Wall 670 19.0/9.2 .515 26.5 .145

Walker 662 16.6/4.2 .470 26.2 .140

Teague 658 16.8/8.0 .518 27.0 .097

Irving 629 20.8/5.8 .490 31.2 .054

Lowry 620 13.9/6.6 .552 18.4 .156

Jennings 619 15.9/8.4 .479 23.9 .071

MCW 551 17.7/7.3 .495 24.7 .091


Steals per game range: from MCW 3.1 to Irving 1.0

TOs per game range: from Lowry 2.3 to MCW 3.7


Merit All-Stars (to date): Wall, Lowry, Teague

* East's 2 best teams - MIA, IND - function without ball dominant PGs

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anomiemnemonical reply to Dollar Bill on Dec 6 at 16:48
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Looks like MCW is already just as good as any player on that list. In fact, better than most or all on the list in each category you listed except turnovers (product of pace, inexperience, and unfamiliar new team & system) also applying win shares to this exercise is pointless imo - team built to artificially limit as many wins as possible and our go-to offensive weapon is Evan Turner.
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MCW is head and shoulders above everone on that list defensively, not going by just steals but his overall defensive game. I think he can be what Shaun Livingston was supposed to be. Right, Bill?

P.S. if you happen to reply, could you limit the usual dactylic hexameteric ABA obscurities, my d.o.b. was in '90

Testing.

Test again.

huh this looks interesting

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mr hand on Dec 6 at 12:44
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This looks nice, one minor suggestion:

The comment header could say 'Brian's Reply to Brian' instead of 'Brian Reply to Brian'.

is it possible where after you read the story the first time it will automatically take you to the comments?

Let me make sure I understand. So after you've read the story, you're asking that when you click the headline on the home page it will take you to the comments instead of the full story if you click on the headline?

not exactly

when i click on the latest comment id prefer if it took me to the comment and not the story

not a huge deal if its not possible

OK, cool. That's no problem, I just haven't made any changes to the home page yet. I'll do that right now.

also not a big deal but did you change the post time to military time or is there something i have to do to change it back

Changed to military time. Had to save space for the mobile phone view.

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anomiemnemonical reply to Brian on Dec 6 at 13:14
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Yeah the latest comment navigation thing was nice.

Also, do you think you can make the back-ground into something with really aggressive bright colors. Like a collage with cool pictures of Evan Turner hitting sweet off balance jumpshots over?

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anomiemnemonical reply to anomiemnemonical on Dec 6 at 13:18
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*over weak-ass double teams that can't hold him.

Maybe there's a trail of fire after the ball like a bad-ass comet?

I was having such a nice day and you had to go and put that image in my head.

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anomiemnemonical reply to Brian on Dec 6 at 13:21
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lol. The new lay-out is nice