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, all the time

I don't know, I just think that if I was an A's fan, something just wouldn't sit right with me. I understand in a way what Beane does, but it seems like he unloads and re-stocks every year. How can a fan base get completely behind a team when they know that as soon as a player becomes good enough, he'll just be shipped somewhere else and they start all over again. Think about us Yanks fans, being able to buy a Jeter t-shirt in '97 and still be wearing it today. Why not get some of these players and lock them up to Robbie Cano like deals? A deal that's good enough to keep a talented young player for 5 years, but not so prohibitive that you can't go out and get a couple of others. I just think I would be extremely frustated, but hey, I'm no genius like Billy!

I am an A's fan and it is frustrating. I was so mad the second half of last season, because Beane shipped out Harden, Blanton, and Gaudin.

I'm still not sure what to think of this deal. I've tried to map it out a million times, but nothing makes sense right now.

Keith reply to Cam on Nov 11 at 14:24

"Think about us Yanks fans, being able to buy a Jeter t-shirt in '97 and still be wearing it today."

... Well, for A's there is always that Eric Chavez jersey t-shirt that one can wear . . .

Cam reply to Keith on Nov 12 at 13:28

Haha, thanks for further proving my point. I have a lot of family in Sacramento and they're all A's fans. They have loyalty but they say the only nice thing about going to the games is you can get in so cheap. Thank the good lord for Mr. Steinbrenner.

jock itch on Nov 11 at 11:23

a's are a loser organization that has no fans to speak of ... the few fans there are (27th in mlb home attendance) are the worst in mlb.

Way to make a broad generalization. Very intelligent

Actually, I went to a playoff game in Oakland a few years back and I was really impressed with their fans. Granted it was a playoff game, and it was the game they clinched against the Twins, and a large portion of the crowd apparently had cataracts, and they didn't open up the upper deck, but the crowd was very knowledgeable and into the game. More than I can say for a lot of the Bronx crowds over the past couple of seasons.

The team has fallen on hard times since then (or been thrust into them by Beane, depending on your POV), but still, there are good baseball fans in Oakland.

Harden- always injured, no matter how high upside. he was a 7mill risk

Blanton- steady mediocrity of a #4 SP

Gaudin- he's like a righty version of greg smith. he complained about his bp role. he got injured and struggled with cubs

I have a feeling this will work out well, he sold high on Huston Street (who had been struggling through last year) and prospects are prospects.

I GUARANTEE some team will be tripping over itself to get him at the trading deadline (hopefully not us).

I've read Moneyball and admire Billy Beane for being able to pull together quality teams (while not World Series teams, still decent teams) on a shoestring budget. He's a lot shrewder than most GMs in the league and has brought about evolution in baseball and the way people think about a player's value. He's more than likely fleeced all the GMs around the league at one time or another in terms of recognizing good talent and getting the better end of the trade.

I'm guessing Holliday is the next big free agent in 2009. In the meantime, Beane has rented a quality player. If they are in contention in July before the trade deadline, Holliday will remain through the season. If the A's are not in contention, he holds perhaps the best bargaining chip going into the trade deadline.

PS... Gotta thank him for Joe Blanton in Philly here. When Kyle Kendrick and Adam Eaton each self destructed, Blanton came in and gave us quality starts and proved to be a good #4 starter.

Mark in Toronto on Nov 11 at 20:06

Actually, Beane has a philosophy of "trading the closer".

He feels that baseball's love affair with closers is actually a market inefficiency - that closers are overvalued.

Beane keeps "creating" new closers, then sending them elsewhere for profit; Jason Isringhausen (whom he acquired as a prospect from the Mets for, you guessed it, former As closer Billy Taylor), Billy Koch, etc., etc...

Street's just the latest example. According to the As, saves are overpriced; a guy comes in in the 9th, and does not always (some would argue "rarely") face the top hitters in the lineup.

So - you can take a slightly above-average pitcher, drop him into the closer's slot, let him accumulate a gaudy number of saves, and then sell him off.
You could, essentially, buy a stock, inflate its' value somewhat artificially, then sell it off for more than you'd paid for it in the first place - especially with compensatory draft picks.

I'm not sure that I'm one hundred percent with this theory, but I offer it as a "why Billy Bean does what he does".

The thing is, Holliday's value will drop when he gets out of Coors and stops hitting .330.

I'm so glad that I'm no A's fan.
I truely believe "Mr. Bean" is crazier than Ozzie.

slash034 on Nov 12 at 7:57

I am an A's fan (sorry if we are not high in attendance or have a huge payroll) but there are a lot of fans and we follow the team with great interest.
This trade is great for several reasons A) we get an elite five tool corner outfielder B) we only give up a marginal starting pitcher, a closer that was benched and a prospect outfielder that did not show a lot last year and C) we are in a no lose situation going forward; we can trade Holliday for a package at the turn or keep him and get a two first round picks for him.

The A's have good fans, I stuck up for you guys above.

I think the general confusion doesn't come from this trade alone, but from the moves the proceeded it. If Beane really wanted to compete in 2009 he wouldn't have traded away those four starters, Haren especially, and if he did he would've gotten some ML-ready help back in the packages, rather than just projects and prospects.

This was a move you'd expect a team to make who just needs one guy to get them over the top this season. The fact that the A's aren't in that position is what leads to my train of thought in the post.

Thanks for the comment.

I think this may have been a misstep by Beane, unless he ends up trading Holliday before the season starts. Check out his career home/away split:

Home (Coors Field): .357/.423/.645 (BA/OBP/SLG), 38 HRs per 162 games

Away: .280/.348/.455, 21 HRs per 162 games

Outside of Coors he's a good, but not great, hitter. If he plays a few months in Oakland and bats .280 with like 12 HRs at the break, his trade value will be tremendously diminished.

Maybe I'm wrong, but it seems like Holliday's value can only go down from here. Beane should try to trade him immediately

He's also going to one of the worst hitters parks in the league, so his drop off may be even more severe.

I'll bet Billy Beane is a mad genius with something up his sleeve. He's a step ahead of most of the managers around the league and has bested many of them in trades.

Mark in Toronto has an excellent post about Beane and the value of a closer. Beane has 'manufactured closers' and elevated their value, only to get good draft picks/prospects in return. And now he's holding onto a hot ticket and waiting for its value to increase. I agree with Brian that Holliday's value will probably go down once he's in a pitcher friendly park, but maybe

I agree that saves are, in general, overrated. K-Fraud will get $$$$$$$ from the Mets, and if you watched him, he really isn't that dominating. He gets hit like the ALDS with the Red Sox showed and walks people. Days of true iron men relievers like Fingers and Gossage, who go for 2-3 innings are gone. Holliday will be good for the A's, either as a better player than most people expect at the OAK home park, or as a trade chip midseason. And I like Billy Beane, if for no other reason than Scott BorASS must hate him!

What is Billy Beane's compesation? I know that he recently signed an extension with the A's, does anyone know what type of compensation package he got and/or where I can find out that information?

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