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Carry It Over Against The Jazz

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bebopdeluxe on Mar 9 at 7:59
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I, too, will be watching closely for JTI's ability to "seamlessly" move the ball to the most favorable mismatch and the hottest hand. Iguodala did a GREAT job with that when Rondo was on Turner - those post-ups were a thing of beauty. The other thing to keep in mind is while Turner certainly did have the ball in his hands a lot, Jrue and Iguodala combined for 14 assists. I'll take that any night.

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Spencer for hire on Mar 9 at 8:38
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I have a question about our coach's defensive gameplanning. How does he take advantage of Evan's rebounding if he put him on a deep shooting p.g. or wing?

Does that play into who Turner covers? It amazes me how quickly he cheats towards the defensive boards, the complete opposite of cherrypicking. Rondo's limited outside shot allowed for that but what if it is S.Curry, for example.

Yup that right there is pretty much the key to Turner's defense. He is very good on the ball, but off the ball he tends to hit the boards instead of fight through picks and chase the opposition.

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Ryan F on Mar 9 at 8:39
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I want to see Turner put his head down and drive to the basket with regularity. That is needed in the starting 5 as much as anything. He has had flashes of aggressiveness before only to settle for 15 footers a game later.

I've been sour on the Sixers for awhile now. Not sour like I am no longer a fan but just disappointed in their pitiful crunch time one dimensional offense. I'm excited to see if Turner can get it going again.
On a side note...looks like Josh Smith could be available for a trade. Thought on a Iguodola /Josh Smith swap ?

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bebopdeluxe reply to Gdog on Mar 9 at 9:22
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I would do Thad/Lou for Smith...then hold out hope that D12 stays in Orlando past the deadline.

Jrue/Turner/Iguodala/Smith/Howard

Would anybody score against us?

That is an intriguing lineup but ultimately ineffective IMO. You need to have the proper balance between offense and defense in your team, not overload the team with defenders and overlap their talents.

Yes that lineup has a realistic chance to become the best defensive lineup ever. At the same time though they might be the worst offensive team in the league. Opposing teams will pack the lane, and completely limit the team to shooting long jumpers and threes. They will pretty much live and die by Holiday's three point shooting.

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Stan reply to Xsago on Mar 9 at 9:41
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Also with a guy like Howard, you wouldn't need another defender at the 4 spot. I think Thaddeus would work well with Howard.

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Spencer for hire reply to Stan on Mar 9 at 9:45
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I agree with you and Xsago but I believe Bebop's point was Howard may choose to come here if we got Smith.

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bebopdeluxe reply to Spencer for hire on Mar 9 at 9:53
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Exactly. I am looking at a Thad/Lou package for Smith solely on its own merits...but if we made that deal, and having Smith and Iggy together on this team made it more attractive for D12, well hey, whatever gets you through the night, brah.

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bebopdeluxe reply to Stan on Mar 9 at 9:50
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I am not saying that I would make the trade for Smith SPECIFICALLY to get Howard...but if bringing Smith in would make us a more desirable destination for Howard this summer (assuming that he is not traded to a team that will then lock him up), that is the cherry on top.

I am not even saying that I necessarily am interested in trading for Smith...and, frankly, I think that the impact that the trade would have on team chemistry for the balance of the season (trading two guys that Collins loves, as well as the impact that Smith would have on Brand's minutes for the balance of the season) may make it a non-starter in Thorn/Collins' eyes. All that I am saying is the decision to move to JTI for the balance of the season already makes it a bit of a petri dish around here...if you are not going to re-sign Lou after he opts out and you are open to amnestying Brand this summer, a trade of - essentially - Thad for Josh Smith would add some interesting dynamics to the team...a dynamic low-post defender and quality defensive rebounder - which this team could sorely benefit from...at the sacrifice of the offensive spark and growing defensive abilities that Thad possesses.

I think there is ZERO chance that it would happen, but if a rumor came up that a trade that had - at its center - Thad and Lou for Smith, I would at least think about it.

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bebopdeluxe reply to Xsago on Mar 9 at 9:41
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I actually think that having Howard on the team will get both Holiday and Iguodala more space to shoot the 3...and both of them have shown that - given the time - they can hit the 3 at a decent clip. What they cannot do, however, is shoot the 3 in a Korver-like, quick release way...but with Howard on the floor, I would think they would get more space on the perimeter...right?

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ryano reply to Xsago on Mar 9 at 10:03
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Ideally every team would want to be perfectly balanced, but if you had to choose between an unbalanced team skewed defensively vs offensively, I'd choose a monster defensive team over a monster offensive team. That line up would be ridiculous- they would only need to score in the low 80's every game to win.

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Ryan F reply to ryano on Mar 9 at 10:12
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A starting 5 of Jrue, Evan, Andre, Josh, and Elton/Hawes would be fairly nasty. Replace Elton/Hawes end of season with Howard, and you have the greatest defensive team ever assembled.

A boy can dream.

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Stan reply to Gdog on Mar 9 at 9:42
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I would not make that trade. Iguodala is a much better player than Smith

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Ryan F reply to Stan on Mar 9 at 9:54
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Arguable. Wouldn't go as far as saying "much" better. Better maybe, much better, probably not. Although I wouldn't want to do a swap of those two if only because its a lateral move at best. If we could find a way to acquire Smith without giving up a mainstay, I'm all for it, but giving out a big piece and getting Smith in return doesn't improve the team.

Lou/cap filler and a pick, I'm in.

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bebopdeluxe reply to Ryan F on Mar 9 at 9:58
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No way that gets it done, IMO. Lou can sign with them this summer (both sides may already be looking at it, as far as we know).

I love Thad - but as much as he does love him some jumpers, there is no denying that adding Smith would improve our interior defense and rebounding in a BIG way...and he would probably flourish in the transition game that JTI should bring to the table.

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Ryan F reply to bebopdeluxe on Mar 9 at 10:07
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Certainly, I would trade trade Thad for Smith, not Iguodala though.

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Ryan F reply to Ryan F on Mar 9 at 10:01
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Or even Thad/Noc for Smith.

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bebopdeluxe reply to Ryan F on Mar 9 at 10:03
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How about Thad/Lou/Noc for Smith and Hinrich (adding two expiring contracts, but Hinrich would help us replace Lou for the balance of the season).

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Stan reply to Ryan F on Mar 9 at 10:03
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I think this team would be much worse if you replaced Iguodala with Smith.

Anyway, If we could get Josh Smith for Lou Williams, Lavoy Allen, a 1st round pick and Andres Nocioni- I would do it.

It would take away cap space for next season, but I wouldn't care. The Dwight Howard idea is pipe dream anyway.

Simmons has his annual trade value column up and somehow does not value AI9 or Jrue in his top 50, but does mention this:

"47. Derrick Favors
46. Evan Turner
Let's see … Philly needs to get bigger … Utah needs to get better on the perimeter … both teams have talented no. 2 overall picks who aren't playing enough … both teams are a little too attached to those guys … the Trade Machine approves … (can't we just call this one in????)"

http://www.grantland.com/story/_/id/7664492/nba-trade-value-part-1

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GoSixers on Mar 9 at 10:22
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Yes, the game tonight is on NBA TV which means I get to see the sixers play in hi def yet again

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Stan reply to GoSixers on Mar 9 at 10:23
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Why do you care so much about hidef? It doesn't make that much of a difference

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Ryan F reply to Stan on Mar 9 at 10:26
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Seriously? Have you ever watched something on a quality television in high definition then immediately switched over to standard? Night and day. I don't even know the channel listing on Verizon for anything under 500.

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Ryan F reply to Ryan F on Mar 9 at 10:28
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I lied. 99 is TCN and I know this only because Verizon does not have a high def channel for this, and I weep when I have to try and watch a game on there 6 to 10 times a year.

Yes. It drives me nuts.

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Ryan F reply to Derek Bodner on Mar 9 at 10:35
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Pisses my girlfriend of more than me, because not only does she have to listen to me yell at a television for 2 1/2 hours, she gets to here me bitch about the feed as well.

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Stan reply to Ryan F on Mar 9 at 10:38
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You guys are spoiled. Try watching these games from a crappy netbook. That pauses every two minutes and gets shutdown before the end of the 4th quarter.

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GoSixers reply to Stan on Mar 9 at 11:19
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So what you're saying is no, you haven't seen a game in hi definition, so you dismiss it as making a difference. It makes a huge difference, and those who have seen games in hi def know that.

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Gdog reply to GoSixers on Mar 9 at 11:45
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He also doesn't hear a difference in CD's vs cassettes. Similar quality :)

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Stan reply to GoSixers on Mar 9 at 13:08
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I've seen hi def but I don't care for it to the point that I look forward to it or change my plans to see it in hi-def

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matt reply to Stan on Mar 9 at 13:11
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In most cases, I'd agree. But for some reason it makes a huge difference with sports

Im surprised we havent heard more about the possibility of a lou williams trade considering he can opt out over the summer. the sixers must think there is a good chance of resigning him if they arent shopping him hard enough for us to hear about it. maybe their being secretive about it, so you never know.

it doesnt make too much sense to have two players paid that well on the bench, so if we resign lou i would think that management believes thad will be a starter at some point.

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bebopdeluxe reply to scott on Mar 9 at 11:13
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I cringe at the thought of giving BOSS a Thad-like deal...which is why I am open to any and all options to manetize his value before the deadline.

I though there was ZERO chance of this a week ago...but in the brave new world of JTI, I wonder if the percentage possability has gone up any.

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Spencer for hire reply to bebopdeluxe on Mar 9 at 11:30
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I was intrigued by what Jamal Crawford got this summer as a comparison for Lou. If 5 to 6 million for 3 years brings him back they may do it. But would Lou.

And how does the league and our team compare Thad and Lou value wise. My thinking is Thad may start next year if the J.T.I. thing works because a] Turner rebounds like a p.f. and b] Thad can take off and fill the wing knowing Evan will be crashing.

He's the only one that can get to the line at will. His ability there is uncanny.

Jrue/Thad are notoiously poor at drawing contact. Andre can sometimes bull his way into contact, but those athletic attacks at the rim are becoming more rare. Evan is kind of split between the two. He plays a finesse game but also has the ability to overpower at times.

I honestly don't mind letting him walk if they bring in some frontcourt help before the deadline. There's not a great small to big exchange rate (Deron Williams -> Derrick Favors) so I find it hard to believe he could be the central piece in a worthwhile deal. Plus, if you did lose him for a big, then Turner almost has to go to the bench and backup the one, two, and three.

I think any deal should be limited to the miniscule trade exception and couple of second round draft picks. Nocioni's contract could help get a bigger deal be done, but it would need to be worth losing the bench depth. I would buy low on Bogut even if he can't play in the regular season, then use the trade exception to fill in the gap.

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anonymous on Mar 9 at 11:15
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I didn't see the game but I noticed Turner only had 2 assists. Is there a difference why Lou is scorned for dominating the ball but not Turner? Lou had 4 in less minutes, and he usually has more.

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bebopdeluxe reply to anonymous on Mar 9 at 11:30
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Because Iguodala and Jrue had 14 assists between them...which is why the whole "Turner is a PG" thing makes no sense to me. If Turner's handling the ball provides better movement and spacing for EVERYBODY to get assists and easier shots, I don't care who gets the assist.

Also, there is more to the addition of Turner than jsut assists...his impact on defense and on the boards cannot be ignored - especially in any comparison with Lou.

Probably because he was 11/19 and attacking when he had the ball, and he didn't have the ball the entire time. They were taking turns initiating, w/ Jrue and AI9 setting guys up while Turner was finishing. If he shot 4/19, I'm sure we'd have a different view on his ball dominance. Much like when Lou has a really good scoring game there isn't a whole lot of complaining about him grinding the offense to a halt.

Have fun with this guys:

>>
Spike Eskin ‏ @SpikeEskin
I'll be interviewing Rod Thorn on WIP between 6p-7p today. Give me questions for him here --> http://bit.ly/xEdxq9

Turner can shoot from the outside, he just doesn't make them. Consequently, teammates have nicknamed his jumper "Cryin' Out Loud" and "The Herbburger"; a new one cropped up yesterday - "Stan's Secret Weapon."

Collins dearly wants Ws, even if it takes playing his nuisance pupil who favors the structure of art class and the thrills of "bombardment" in gym. Rest of the regular season: "Framing the Future" or "26 Skidoo."

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Spencer for hire reply to Dollar Bill on Mar 9 at 11:58
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My hope is he reaches average at least, as an outside shooter. Rythm and minutes may help in that respect. Thad has gone from being told not to shoot to being pretty good in less than a year.

I have more concern over whether or not Turner can help this team play winning basketball than whether he will eventually hit the jumper at a solid rate.

His Ohio St. teams won 20 some games but never won it all so I hope the way he plays can improve our teams chances.

It'll be interesting. Chicago and Indianapolis present challenges unseen in nearby Evanston and West Lafayette, respectively. And Doug Collins is not Thad Matta.

Outside of JTI---I would trade any combination of 2 players on this team to get Josh Smith. Even straight up for Iguodola would be a good deal for the Sixers long term.
Is Iggy a better player than Smith ? Maybe overall but we have guys who can do what Iggy does (just not as well)--we have NO ONE who can rebound and defend like Josh Smith.

Does Smith rebound and defend consistently? He's dominant in spurts, but sometimes he looks like he's doggin' it. Yes, a lot of talent. Jumper takes frequent vacations.

His jumper should take a permanent vacation. He'd be a much better player if he never used it.

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matt reply to Gdog on Mar 9 at 13:14
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The funny thing is, out of Smoove/Iggy/Thad/Lou their WS/48 are the exact opposite of how I'd perceive them. I don't think I could justify dealing Iggy for Josh Smith, but for some reason I keep telling myself I'd move Thad AND Lou.

It should but many could say the same about Iguodola. (who I love as a player overall, just so you think im not hatin)

I like the idea of a dominant power forward coming here.
I would hate to give up Iggy--but you have to give up quality to get quality. No ones trading a quality power forward for 2 bench players.

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Gdog reply to Gdog on Mar 9 at 12:22
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response fail. My prior comment was in response to Brians comment about smiths jumper.

Simmons' Trade Value Column:

47. Derrick Favors
46. Evan Turner
Let's see … Philly needs to get bigger … Utah needs to get better on the perimeter … both teams have talented no. 2 overall picks who aren't playing enough … both teams are a little too attached to those guys … the Trade Machine approves … (can't we just call this one in????)

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matt reply to Rich on Mar 9 at 13:30
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Strange that they both got picked #2 in the same draft

Was Kanter #2 this past season? Thought that was who he was referring to on Utah's side.

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matt reply to Brian on Mar 9 at 13:39
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Went over my head if he did. So, Kanter for Turner?

No, two unrelated things.

1) Trade Turner for Favors

2) Both teams have a #2 pick who is sort of blocked. Turner for Philly (solve it by trading him), Kanter for Utah (solve it by moving Favors out of his way).

If Utah called and offered this today I would say yes without a second's hesitation.

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matt reply to Brian on Mar 9 at 13:40
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Actually, no because it was Irving, DWill, Kanter. And Wall, Turner, Favors.

There you go. He was wrong. Utah has a couple of #3 picks who are splitting minutes.

Hollinger has a list of trades that should happen. One of them sends Brackins and the New Orleans 2013 second rounder to the Kings for JJ Hickson.

TK used to love Hickson, I've never been a fan, but you'd have to at least consider that deal. Hickson's more physical than Brackins, maybe catch lightning in a bottle w/out giving up anything of value. Also clear a little cap space, think Hickson is a restricted FA next summer.

At a minimum, Hickson has shown he can rebound a little and finish when he's spoon fed the ball on the inside. Two skills the Sixers are lacking up front.

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Stan reply to Brian on Mar 9 at 13:49
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2 years ago Cleveland wouldn't trade him to bring in Amare (according to some report). It's funny how playing with a superstar increases your value and perception tremendously.

It's really funny how perceptions like that have lasting impacts, as well. If they had gotten Amare and given him $100M+, they'd probably be regretting it right now as Amare's age is showing. So overvaluing Hickson hurt them in the short term, because they could've had Amare when he was really productive. But in the long run, not making the move probably turned out better for the organization. All of this is, of course, assuming Amare's troubles are physical and specific to him, and not directly related to Carmelo Anthony gutting that team with his isolation hero bullshit.

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Stan reply to Brian on Mar 9 at 15:22
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They might have kept Lebron and they might have made it past the semifinals vs. Boston. I don't know how Cleveland's future would have panned out. The only reason why they have a promising future is because Sterling made an awful trade.

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GoSixers reply to Stan on Mar 9 at 15:38
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They weren't keeping Lebron - it was prearranged - long before the final season in Cleveland started, that Lebron was going to miami with bosh...

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bebopdeluxe reply to Brian on Mar 9 at 14:04
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That's a no-brainer yo.

Yeah, the guy really fell off the fact of the earth after Lebron left. I wonder if there is something off the court going on there.

In terms of spoon feeding, I'd think he'd get some good looks on the Sixers. I think the talent is there fro hi to be a good P&R player and finisher on easy looks. Obviously not a great defender or rebounder- but the Sxiers schematically have done well with Thad at PF, so it could work. I think it really comes down to whether there are some off the couort issues that preclude Hickson from playing well if given the opportunity (Think Speights.(

Sixers get: Bogut
Bucks get: Brand, JR. Smith, J. Jordan, Douglas, Novak
Knicks get: Jackson, Delfino

Sixers gamble on injury-prone big man, but don't give up too much. Bucks get rid of said injury-prone big-man and a bad contract in Jackson. They also can dump Smith after the season. Knicks get a SG that would fit their offense and who would like to play in NYC. They only give up assets and even get a decent backup SF in Delfino.

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=7swq37b

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bebopdeluxe reply to Phil on Mar 9 at 14:45
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Don't give up much?

We get Andrew Bogut - an All-Star-caliber C when healthy - and all we give up is Brand? We get the best asset in the deal and don't have to take on the cancer?

Ummmm....OK.

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Stan reply to Phil on Mar 9 at 15:01
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I'd love that trade. But Milwaukee is giving up too much. Also, I'd make that trade just to see a Stephen Jackson-Carmelo Anthony- Amare lineup.

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bebopdeluxe reply to Stan on Mar 9 at 15:19
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LOL

They will redefine Run and Gun...

More like Gun and Gun.

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Phil reply to Stan on Mar 9 at 15:51
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Read today that the Bucks are willing to trade Bogut, but only packaged with Jackson. This trade would free cap space for them in the very near future. Maybe the Sixers and/or Knicks would have to give up some picks as well ...

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bebopdeluxe reply to Phil on Mar 9 at 15:53
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I would be VERY interested in Bogut...would have to be a 3-way...no interest in Jackson...

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GoSixers reply to bebopdeluxe on Mar 9 at 16:14
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No one in the NBA has interest in Stephen Jackson or he would have been traded already.

The same way you can't get dwight howard without taking tukoglus vomitous contract

I still find it so unbelievably funny that Orlando traded for that contract, and gave up Gortat in the deal. Hilarious.

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Phil reply to GoSixers on Mar 9 at 16:27
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GMs work in their own way ... Gerald Wallace and Lamar Odom got traded for nothing.

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GoSixers reply to Phil on Mar 9 at 16:31
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Lamar Odom wasn't traded for 'nothing' - he was traded to help the Lakers make a move that they haven't been able to make yes...wallace had talent

The bucks have been trying to move Jackson for most of the season...and off season...ever since bitching about an extension

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Phil reply to GoSixers on Mar 9 at 16:58
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There was no reason to get trigger happy and deal Odom like 2 days after the nixed Paul trade. It was a bad move.

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GoSixers reply to Phil on Mar 9 at 17:43
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It wasn't really a bad move for a variety of reasons, one because Lamar Odom was a pouty baby and you've seen how he has played in Dallas this year right? He took it personally and got all pouty...I live in the LA market so the news reports a lot more than you probably get.

The move also wasn't a solitary move, it was a move that was supposed to have other moves behind it just because they couldn't get them done doesn't mean it wasn't a good plan, something just fell apart.

Thirdly, and fans whine about it or not - teams dont like paying the luxury tax forever

any guesses to where gasol is headed

https://twitter.com/#!/lazenby/status/178214610996965376

I'd lmao if he's traded for his brother.

To the Sixers for Turner, Lou, Nocioni and a first-round pick.

Report refuted by Wojo. Also states the Rockets have been close to getting it done.


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